5 ms·

> Given all my friends that worked for them, almost all have quit within 5 years. 5 years is pretty darn high by tech company standard, as people already menti

by shados 7y ago

> Given all my friends that worked for them, almost all have quit within 5 years. 5 years is pretty darn high by tech company standard, as people already mentioned. Partly because of the culture of "you have to jump ship to make more money and promotions", but even the most employee friendly company will barely edge that, just because software engineers have a huge "grass is greener" syndrome.

crooked-v 7y ago
>just because software engineers have a huge "grass is greener" syndrome "Grass is greener" is a strange label to use for the ability of even mediocre developers to get $50K+ raises by switching jobs, while the industry as a whole remains myopic about giving comparable pay increases to existing employees.
- whatshisface 7y ago
  The grass is greener from the employer's perspective, which is why they manage their HR with a negative risk premium.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- IloveHN84 7y ago
  Yeah, it's really rare that the company where you work for more than 5 years gives you a $50K+ raise, if you get 5k or 10K you are already at the top. But you are invaluable, because of all the stuff you've learned and can do.. leaving will mean bigger costs
- shados 7y ago
  I said even at company friendly companies. Basically you'll see this happen even at companies where you CANT just switch job to get a raise (eg: companies that give out RSUs and had huge stock value bumps, making it unlikely you can get the same elsewhere). I've seen it happen many times. People who got promotions after promotions and are paid absurd amounts, and after 2-3 years will jump ship anyway, often with a pay cut to join their friend's little startup. Which is fine, its their choice and if they like that better, they certainly can go for it. That doesn't change that it's basically cultural at this point. Software engineers jump ship really quickly, even if everything's perfect (which, admittedly, is rare). I've done it many times myself.
  - xchaotic 7y ago
    It's a bit like this: if the pay is too low, you make the jump to get the money. If the money is good, you wait a few years and make a jump anyway because hopefully by then you've saved enough to be set for life (assuming normal pay elsewhere)
kylek 7y ago
I think "5 years" is a good indicator for amzn, as many (most?) L4/L5's sign up with a big chunk of stock that takes 4 years to vest.
- franczesko 7y ago
  You've hit the nail on the head
- rhizome 7y ago
  Some companies have sabbatical programs that arrive at 7-10 years. A paid 6mo-year off? I'm listening.
digianarchist 7y ago
The longest I've stayed at a job since graduating is three years. If companies had better career paths and gave good raises that might be longer.
hermitdev 7y ago
I spent over 9 years as a software engineer at a finance shop known for it's high turnover and burn out rate. Average life expectancy in IT when I joined eas 1.5-2 years. I do and dont regret having stayed that long. Some of my long term health issues are due in part to my time there. No way to prove it, of course. I worked with a lot of great people, but years of sustained 80-100 hour work weeks, getting called on the rare vacation and the inability to have a personal life (only dated for a total of like 5 months in the 9 years I was there). I didnt get married until 5 years after I left, and ironically to the exwife of a former coworker from the same firm. The pisser is that I was grossly underpaid for 7 of those 9 years. I was taken advantage of because I was a mew hire directly out of college. After several years, I realized this as I became a defect team lead and assumed about 13x the responsibility I was hired for within 2 years. It took a written offer from well, Amazon, to get my pay adjusted. I got a 50% pay increase midyear to stay... Ive since moved on, and honestly, not sure which decision I regret. I'm still in finance, but a lower stress firm, with a dead simple commute, typically 40 mins in the car tops per day, round trip. Id be far happier if I was suffering from the pain of accumulated medical issues.

by shados 7y ago

crooked-v 7y ago

>just because software engineers have a huge "grass is greener" syndrome "Grass is greener" is a strange label to use for the ability of even mediocre developers to get $50K+ raises by switching jobs, while the industry as a whole remains myopic about giving comparable pay increases to existing employees.

whatshisface 7y ago
The grass is greener from the employer's perspective, which is why they manage their HR with a negative risk premium.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
IloveHN84 7y ago
Yeah, it's really rare that the company where you work for more than 5 years gives you a $50K+ raise, if you get 5k or 10K you are already at the top. But you are invaluable, because of all the stuff you've learned and can do.. leaving will mean bigger costs
shados 7y ago
I said even at company friendly companies. Basically you'll see this happen even at companies where you CANT just switch job to get a raise (eg: companies that give out RSUs and had huge stock value bumps, making it unlikely you can get the same elsewhere). I've seen it happen many times. People who got promotions after promotions and are paid absurd amounts, and after 2-3 years will jump ship anyway, often with a pay cut to join their friend's little startup. Which is fine, its their choice and if they like that better, they certainly can go for it. That doesn't change that it's basically cultural at this point. Software engineers jump ship really quickly, even if everything's perfect (which, admittedly, is rare). I've done it many times myself.
- xchaotic 7y ago
  It's a bit like this: if the pay is too low, you make the jump to get the money. If the money is good, you wait a few years and make a jump anyway because hopefully by then you've saved enough to be set for life (assuming normal pay elsewhere)

kylek 7y ago

I think "5 years" is a good indicator for amzn, as many (most?) L4/L5's sign up with a big chunk of stock that takes 4 years to vest.

franczesko 7y ago
You've hit the nail on the head
rhizome 7y ago
Some companies have sabbatical programs that arrive at 7-10 years. A paid 6mo-year off? I'm listening.

digianarchist 7y ago

The longest I've stayed at a job since graduating is three years. If companies had better career paths and gave good raises that might be longer.

hermitdev 7y ago

I spent over 9 years as a software engineer at a finance shop known for it's high turnover and burn out rate. Average life expectancy in IT when I joined eas 1.5-2 years. I do and dont regret having stayed that long. Some of my long term health issues are due in part to my time there. No way to prove it, of course. I worked with a lot of great people, but years of sustained 80-100 hour work weeks, getting called on the rare vacation and the inability to have a personal life (only dated for a total of like 5 months in the 9 years I was there). I didnt get married until 5 years after I left, and ironically to the exwife of a former coworker from the same firm. The pisser is that I was grossly underpaid for 7 of those 9 years. I was taken advantage of because I was a mew hire directly out of college. After several years, I realized this as I became a defect team lead and assumed about 13x the responsibility I was hired for within 2 years. It took a written offer from well, Amazon, to get my pay adjusted. I got a 50% pay increase midyear to stay... Ive since moved on, and honestly, not sure which decision I regret. I'm still in finance, but a lower stress firm, with a dead simple commute, typically 40 mins in the car tops per day, round trip. Id be far happier if I was suffering from the pain of accumulated medical issues.