4 ms·

What’s wrong with hosting a manifesto? Getting insight into the state of mind of such an individual seems valuable, no?

r3bl 7y ago
Maybe to you and me, but we're not its target audience. Its target audience is other 8chan users, some of which might be just a step away from committing such atrocities themselves.
- coldtea 7y ago
  And not seeing the manifesto will stop them, right? Sounds like a genius plan. Don't ban easy access to guns, don't change a crazy individualistic/every man for themselves/violence loving culture. Just hide the manifestos, that should work. (Cue the "one doesn't prevent us doing the other" answers).
  - r3bl 7y ago
    Where did I claim it's the only thing needed to stop a person like that? You gotta start somewhere. This is a nice and easy way to do that's completely within the reach of the tech community. There are no laws requiring that, just a sign of a good will. If it were up to me, Cloudflare would block at least 30 other websites, starting with Gab. Unfortunately, it takes a shooting or two for them to realize that they have a problem with a client of theirs.
    - coldtea 7y ago
      >Where did I claim it's the only thing needed to stop a person like that? Nowhere, but I already covered that. I wrote "(Cue the "[doing this] doesn't prevent us doing the other" answers)".
  - LargeWu 7y ago
    It's not just the manifesto. Places like 8chan are positive feedback generators for this kind of extremism. Every time one of these events happen it fuels the sort of unofficial contest to see who can be the next one, to be the next hero/martyr of the community. Easy access to guns is certainly a problem, but easy access to these radicalization factories is also a significant component that needs to be addressed.
artlovecode 7y ago
If that's your goal you need to put it in context, like what museums and libraries do. When mixed inbetween memes, there's no context. It's just vitriol being spread
king_magic 7y ago
What’s wrong with hosting a manifesto? It should be blindingly obvious: when they spread extremism and terrorism like a virus, there’s plenty wrong. It might make the tiniest bit of sense if we were collectively able to do something preventative about mass murders before they happened by using that “insight”. That certainly does not seem to be happening. No, I think the time is coming where white supremacist manifestos and the like should be actively stamped out by society.
- coldtea 7y ago
  >What’s wrong with hosting a manifesto? It should be blindingly obvious: when they spread extremism and terrorism like a virus, there’s plenty wrong. Yeah, a state that is constantly in war(s), paints the target countries du jour as the enemy building racism against their citizens, tolerates torture and police shootings (letting officers that do that shit free), and is obsessed with violence and gun ownership, suddenly is worried about "spreading extremism".
  - king_magic 7y ago
    So let’s open the floodgates because some things are wrong in the world? Nah, no thanks.
    - coldtea 7y ago
      No, "let's fix the way worse systemic things helping breed, nurture, and arm wackos, and then you can decide about them posting on some board".
      - king_magic 7y ago
        We’re doing a bang-up job of fixing those “way worse systemic things”. How’s that working out?
        coldtea 7y ago
        I guess that's sarcasm, since I don't see anybody doing any kind of job (much less a bang-up one) of fixing those "way worse systemic things". In light of this, worse than band-aids like "let's close the internet forums they frequent" is the new blaming heavy metal and computer games for mass shootings...
pwf 7y ago
It's not about the manifesto: https://www.bellingcat.com/news/americas/2019/08/04/the-el-paso-shooting-and-the-gamification-of-terror/ https://www.bellingcat.com/news/americas/2019/08/04/the-el-p...
magpi3 7y ago
Giving hate manifestos easy access to a global audience can help get more people killed.

r3bl 7y ago

Maybe to you and me, but we're not its target audience. Its target audience is other 8chan users, some of which might be just a step away from committing such atrocities themselves.

coldtea 7y ago
And not seeing the manifesto will stop them, right? Sounds like a genius plan. Don't ban easy access to guns, don't change a crazy individualistic/every man for themselves/violence loving culture. Just hide the manifestos, that should work. (Cue the "one doesn't prevent us doing the other" answers).
- r3bl 7y ago
  Where did I claim it's the only thing needed to stop a person like that? You gotta start somewhere. This is a nice and easy way to do that's completely within the reach of the tech community. There are no laws requiring that, just a sign of a good will. If it were up to me, Cloudflare would block at least 30 other websites, starting with Gab. Unfortunately, it takes a shooting or two for them to realize that they have a problem with a client of theirs.
  - coldtea 7y ago
    >Where did I claim it's the only thing needed to stop a person like that? Nowhere, but I already covered that. I wrote "(Cue the "[doing this] doesn't prevent us doing the other" answers)".
- LargeWu 7y ago
  It's not just the manifesto. Places like 8chan are positive feedback generators for this kind of extremism. Every time one of these events happen it fuels the sort of unofficial contest to see who can be the next one, to be the next hero/martyr of the community. Easy access to guns is certainly a problem, but easy access to these radicalization factories is also a significant component that needs to be addressed.

artlovecode 7y ago

If that's your goal you need to put it in context, like what museums and libraries do. When mixed inbetween memes, there's no context. It's just vitriol being spread

king_magic 7y ago

What’s wrong with hosting a manifesto? It should be blindingly obvious: when they spread extremism and terrorism like a virus, there’s plenty wrong. It might make the tiniest bit of sense if we were collectively able to do something preventative about mass murders before they happened by using that “insight”. That certainly does not seem to be happening. No, I think the time is coming where white supremacist manifestos and the like should be actively stamped out by society.

coldtea 7y ago
>What’s wrong with hosting a manifesto? It should be blindingly obvious: when they spread extremism and terrorism like a virus, there’s plenty wrong. Yeah, a state that is constantly in war(s), paints the target countries du jour as the enemy building racism against their citizens, tolerates torture and police shootings (letting officers that do that shit free), and is obsessed with violence and gun ownership, suddenly is worried about "spreading extremism".
- king_magic 7y ago
  So let’s open the floodgates because some things are wrong in the world? Nah, no thanks.
  - coldtea 7y ago
    No, "let's fix the way worse systemic things helping breed, nurture, and arm wackos, and then you can decide about them posting on some board".
    - king_magic 7y ago
      We’re doing a bang-up job of fixing those “way worse systemic things”. How’s that working out?
      - coldtea 7y ago
        I guess that's sarcasm, since I don't see anybody doing any kind of job (much less a bang-up one) of fixing those "way worse systemic things". In light of this, worse than band-aids like "let's close the internet forums they frequent" is the new blaming heavy metal and computer games for mass shootings...

pwf 7y ago

It's not about the manifesto: https://www.bellingcat.com/news/americas/2019/08/04/the-el-paso-shooting-and-the-gamification-of-terror/ https://www.bellingcat.com/news/americas/2019/08/04/the-el-p...

magpi3 7y ago

Giving hate manifestos easy access to a global audience can help get more people killed.