4 ms·

Yes, from own experiences, the cheap carts [dank/mario cart] which are black market only labels use thc analogues while the ones that make it here that are sold

Yes, from own experiences, the cheap carts [dank/mario cart] which are black market only labels use thc analogues while the ones that make it here that are sold in dispensaries are generally legit [rove/tko] From what I've read about opiate analogues, whatever thc analogues they're using ~15 years after the Huffman paper are far removed from their original state. I can also confirm there is a tremendous demand for thc carts in non-legal states.

SynthCann 7y ago
Very interesting to see JWH discussed on HN. This stuff was BIGGG about a decade ago, and then I stopped hearing about it. It's crazy to see they are still playing the game of cat and mouse with these analogues, and even getting them into the black market carts. I have medical so thankfully I don't need to mess with the black market at this point. I would _highly_ advise against using any synthetic cannabinoids.
- tempguy9999 7y ago
  > I would _highly_ advise against using any synthetic cannabinoids. Any specific reasons to say this? Medical knowledge, personal experience or other? I did have one experience with a synthetic cannabinoid and it was very bad indeed, took me days to recover. FYI. I'd not rule out trying it again but with great care. Though now it's illegal in the UK, so prob won't happen.
  - sterlind 7y ago
    I remember there being a number of deaths from some cannabinoids, but after doing some research I can't confirm. This is what I found: AMB-FUBINACA caused a "zombie outbreak" which sent 33 people to the hospital in Brooklyn: https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/14/nyregion/zombielike-state-was-caused-by-synthetic-marijuana.html https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/14/nyregion/zombielike-state... Anecdotally, AM-2201 seems to cause enlarged liver and other health problems with long-term use: https://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=95702 https://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=95702 I remember CP-55,940 and WIN-55,212 having serious side effects but I couldn't find information..
    - tempguy9999 7y ago
      Comprehensive answer. I particularly appreciate you made it clear what you couldn't verify, or what was anecdotal. I wish I could upvote it twice for that alone.
  - SargeZT 7y ago
    Many of them are full agonists on the cannabanoid receptors, which leads to GABA levels that are dangerously low when the receptors are saturated. THC proper lowers GABA somewhat, but not nearly as much. They've lead to seizures and have been linked to at least a few deaths.
- WalterSear 7y ago
  They aren't. Parent is misinformed.
  - buttcoinslol 7y ago
    I likely am, it was speculation on my part. Thank you for providing more concrete information, I should've noted that I was speculating.
WalterSear 7y ago
Not analogs. The analogs can kill you via overdose. That's not happening here.
- jdc 7y ago
  Not disputing, but do you have a source handy?
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - WalterSear 7y ago
    Natural cannabinoids only have a limited affinity for the endocannabinoid synapse. >Studies have found that these compounds tend to activate the CB1 receptor to a greater degree than does THC, suggesting that synthetic marijuana compounds have the ability to induce far more intense effects than marijuana, according to the review. https://www.livescience.com/57747-synthetic-marijuana-risks.html https://www.livescience.com/57747-synthetic-marijuana-risks.... >Much of our understanding of cannabinoid tolerance, dependence and withdrawal has been based on studies involving Δ9-THC, a relatively weak partial agonist at CB1 and CB2 receptors. However, the SCBs commonly found in quasi-legal commercial products such as K2 and Spice are typically full cannabinoid receptor agonists. Importantly, a drug's efficacy determines how “powerful” its maximal effects may be in biological systems. A low efficacy cannabinoid like Δ9-THC will have a less pronounced maximal effect than a higher efficacy cannabinoid, such as the SCBs present in commercial products, and this difference in maximal effects cannot be overcome simply by increasing the dose of Δ9-THC. In other words, no amount of Δ9-THC can stimulate cannabinoid receptors to the same degree as the SCBs currently emerging as drugs of abuse. This has left researchers working with these high efficacy SCBs in the unusual position of having to determine whether their effects are related to the unprecedented degree of cannabinoid receptor stimulation elicited by these compounds, or whether they are produced by interactions with other, non-cannabinoid receptor systems. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4582439/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4582439/
- Jarwain 7y ago
  I'd imagine that would depend on the analogue

SynthCann 7y ago

Very interesting to see JWH discussed on HN. This stuff was BIGGG about a decade ago, and then I stopped hearing about it. It's crazy to see they are still playing the game of cat and mouse with these analogues, and even getting them into the black market carts. I have medical so thankfully I don't need to mess with the black market at this point. I would _highly_ advise against using any synthetic cannabinoids.

tempguy9999 7y ago
> I would _highly_ advise against using any synthetic cannabinoids. Any specific reasons to say this? Medical knowledge, personal experience or other? I did have one experience with a synthetic cannabinoid and it was very bad indeed, took me days to recover. FYI. I'd not rule out trying it again but with great care. Though now it's illegal in the UK, so prob won't happen.
- sterlind 7y ago
  I remember there being a number of deaths from some cannabinoids, but after doing some research I can't confirm. This is what I found: AMB-FUBINACA caused a "zombie outbreak" which sent 33 people to the hospital in Brooklyn: https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/14/nyregion/zombielike-state-was-caused-by-synthetic-marijuana.html https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/14/nyregion/zombielike-state... Anecdotally, AM-2201 seems to cause enlarged liver and other health problems with long-term use: https://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=95702 https://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=95702 I remember CP-55,940 and WIN-55,212 having serious side effects but I couldn't find information..
  - tempguy9999 7y ago
    Comprehensive answer. I particularly appreciate you made it clear what you couldn't verify, or what was anecdotal. I wish I could upvote it twice for that alone.
- SargeZT 7y ago
  Many of them are full agonists on the cannabanoid receptors, which leads to GABA levels that are dangerously low when the receptors are saturated. THC proper lowers GABA somewhat, but not nearly as much. They've lead to seizures and have been linked to at least a few deaths.
WalterSear 7y ago
They aren't. Parent is misinformed.
- buttcoinslol 7y ago
  I likely am, it was speculation on my part. Thank you for providing more concrete information, I should've noted that I was speculating.

WalterSear 7y ago

Not analogs. The analogs can kill you via overdose. That's not happening here.

jdc 7y ago
Not disputing, but do you have a source handy?
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- WalterSear 7y ago
  Natural cannabinoids only have a limited affinity for the endocannabinoid synapse. >Studies have found that these compounds tend to activate the CB1 receptor to a greater degree than does THC, suggesting that synthetic marijuana compounds have the ability to induce far more intense effects than marijuana, according to the review. https://www.livescience.com/57747-synthetic-marijuana-risks.html https://www.livescience.com/57747-synthetic-marijuana-risks.... >Much of our understanding of cannabinoid tolerance, dependence and withdrawal has been based on studies involving Δ9-THC, a relatively weak partial agonist at CB1 and CB2 receptors. However, the SCBs commonly found in quasi-legal commercial products such as K2 and Spice are typically full cannabinoid receptor agonists. Importantly, a drug's efficacy determines how “powerful” its maximal effects may be in biological systems. A low efficacy cannabinoid like Δ9-THC will have a less pronounced maximal effect than a higher efficacy cannabinoid, such as the SCBs present in commercial products, and this difference in maximal effects cannot be overcome simply by increasing the dose of Δ9-THC. In other words, no amount of Δ9-THC can stimulate cannabinoid receptors to the same degree as the SCBs currently emerging as drugs of abuse. This has left researchers working with these high efficacy SCBs in the unusual position of having to determine whether their effects are related to the unprecedented degree of cannabinoid receptor stimulation elicited by these compounds, or whether they are produced by interactions with other, non-cannabinoid receptor systems. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4582439/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4582439/
Jarwain 7y ago
I'd imagine that would depend on the analogue