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I think the bigger problem is the overall influence that "traditional learning" has on the mindset of the learner. In both the USA and China, you can see what e

I think the bigger problem is the overall influence that "traditional learning" has on the mindset of the learner. In both the USA and China, you can see what every young person's mindset is focused on - studying for that big college entrance exam. Everything is simply a means to achieving a good score on that exam. Perhaps if we allowed kids to move away from that idea of the "big college entrance exam" or similar we could dive into the deeper stuff like...what do YOU want to be when you get older, what problems do YOU want to try to solve and so on. If someone wants to work on video games then start pushing them down that path as soon as possible...get them to learn coding, media design, computer graphics and so on.

AstralStorm 7y ago
China does not care what you want, and neither does the market economy. They want you to be what they need. There are two ways to sort it out: teach people how to learn first, and teach them how a (small) variety of professions that are in demand work. Only then, specialization. Current Chinese model is to identify talents early then force specialize and reject people even at advanced stages, leaving them with nothing. Western model used to be more general even a century back, but is going now more the same way. People are passed without working knowledge of estimation and arithmetics even, have no idea about basic politics and more.
- newguy1234 7y ago
  Oh yeah, I completely agree. An ideal education system needs to be something that is more open to everyone and able to teach people at different levels and for different purposes. Have courses for vocational skills and courses for more academic/theoretical type learning. The factory model of education is obsolete.
  - AstralStorm 7y ago
    It's not the old factory model at all. It's the model taken from competitive sports. It is superior in employing talent but leaves many broken people ultimately resulting in social costs. Short name: rat race. Old factory model provided identical education, relatively broad, to everyone (zero help if you got stuck) - and provided single vocational education on top. (Including research vocations.) Yet more ancient one started with a trade education based on propinquity; rather than scouting and filtering.
sidibe 7y ago
> In both the USA and China, you can see what every young person's mindset is focused on - studying for that big college entrance exam. Everything is simply a means to achieving a good score on that exam. This is less true in the USA than any other country I know of. The "college entrance exam" is not nearly as decisive or as prepared for as in other countries and most of the curriculum has nothing to do with it.
- Vrondi 7y ago
  In the USA, we do not even use the same college entrance exam in all higher ed systems. Different state systems use different exams, and then so does each private college and university. There are several, and which you take (or you may take several) depends where you are applying.
  - bobthepanda 7y ago
    It's also not one exam, in the sense that it gets held multiple times a year and retaking it (if you're willing to pay for it) is possible and a lot of people do it and submit their best scores. The SAT & ACT are also mostly limited to the humanities and math (and science for the ACT), with an optional writing section. China requires Math, Chinese, a foreign language, and any three of Physics, Chemistry, Biology, Geography, Politics, and History. With the SAT all those elective subjects are separate exams and most people do not take them.
- bobthepanda 7y ago
  I think another big factor is that past a certain point university prestige doesn't really matter in the US. In East Asia a lot of stock is put into reputation of university that you get into, but the well of decent American universities that get you good job prospects is much deeper.

AstralStorm 7y ago

China does not care what you want, and neither does the market economy. They want you to be what they need. There are two ways to sort it out: teach people how to learn first, and teach them how a (small) variety of professions that are in demand work. Only then, specialization. Current Chinese model is to identify talents early then force specialize and reject people even at advanced stages, leaving them with nothing. Western model used to be more general even a century back, but is going now more the same way. People are passed without working knowledge of estimation and arithmetics even, have no idea about basic politics and more.

newguy1234 7y ago
Oh yeah, I completely agree. An ideal education system needs to be something that is more open to everyone and able to teach people at different levels and for different purposes. Have courses for vocational skills and courses for more academic/theoretical type learning. The factory model of education is obsolete.
- AstralStorm 7y ago
  It's not the old factory model at all. It's the model taken from competitive sports. It is superior in employing talent but leaves many broken people ultimately resulting in social costs. Short name: rat race. Old factory model provided identical education, relatively broad, to everyone (zero help if you got stuck) - and provided single vocational education on top. (Including research vocations.) Yet more ancient one started with a trade education based on propinquity; rather than scouting and filtering.

sidibe 7y ago

> In both the USA and China, you can see what every young person's mindset is focused on - studying for that big college entrance exam. Everything is simply a means to achieving a good score on that exam. This is less true in the USA than any other country I know of. The "college entrance exam" is not nearly as decisive or as prepared for as in other countries and most of the curriculum has nothing to do with it.

Vrondi 7y ago
In the USA, we do not even use the same college entrance exam in all higher ed systems. Different state systems use different exams, and then so does each private college and university. There are several, and which you take (or you may take several) depends where you are applying.
- bobthepanda 7y ago
  It's also not one exam, in the sense that it gets held multiple times a year and retaking it (if you're willing to pay for it) is possible and a lot of people do it and submit their best scores. The SAT & ACT are also mostly limited to the humanities and math (and science for the ACT), with an optional writing section. China requires Math, Chinese, a foreign language, and any three of Physics, Chemistry, Biology, Geography, Politics, and History. With the SAT all those elective subjects are separate exams and most people do not take them.
bobthepanda 7y ago
I think another big factor is that past a certain point university prestige doesn't really matter in the US. In East Asia a lot of stock is put into reputation of university that you get into, but the well of decent American universities that get you good job prospects is much deeper.