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> how do we expect these users to know anything about addresses Here's an experiment: walk down any street in the US. Actually, scratch that, because there's a

> how do we expect these users to know anything about addresses Here's an experiment: walk down any street in the US. Actually, scratch that, because there's a good chance that you live in SF or Seattle and your streets are filled with computer programmers. Call a random number in a random area code. Ask them what the difference between HTTP and HTTPS is. The users already don't know.

inetknght 7y ago
Then educate them.
- asdfman123 7y ago
  Which goes to my point: wanting users to be better educated is wishful thinking. Do you have a plan to educate even 90% of users? That would be a dream come true, but that still leaves a gaping hole of 10%. I would guess 90% of programmers could explain the difference between HTTP and HTTPS (the other 10% being the dreadfully incompetent). Right now I'm guessing we're at 5% or so and no amount of wanting that to not be true will change that.
  - gsich 7y ago
    Yes, by not hiding any relevant information. It's a good start.
  - inetknght 7y ago
    > Do you have a plan to educate even 90% of users? No, but I could easily create one if I was paid to put my mind to it. Just as a hobby, I already educate peers about how a lot of the internet and web and technology work anyway. I don't really have a desire to add to my life the stress of dealing with the terrible decisions, past and present, of "modern" UI driven almost completely by shady marketing tactics encouraged and often forced by business. I certainly don't have the desire to do so without compensation to offset that stress.
magashna 7y ago
So the answer is to make it even more obscure?
rchaud 7y ago
Given the state of civics education in many parts of the country, a significant portion of people may not know how laws are passed. That doesn't give governments carte blanche to start passing laws in secret, because "people already don't know how it works".

inetknght 7y ago

Then educate them.

asdfman123 7y ago
Which goes to my point: wanting users to be better educated is wishful thinking. Do you have a plan to educate even 90% of users? That would be a dream come true, but that still leaves a gaping hole of 10%. I would guess 90% of programmers could explain the difference between HTTP and HTTPS (the other 10% being the dreadfully incompetent). Right now I'm guessing we're at 5% or so and no amount of wanting that to not be true will change that.
- gsich 7y ago
  Yes, by not hiding any relevant information. It's a good start.
- inetknght 7y ago
  > Do you have a plan to educate even 90% of users? No, but I could easily create one if I was paid to put my mind to it. Just as a hobby, I already educate peers about how a lot of the internet and web and technology work anyway. I don't really have a desire to add to my life the stress of dealing with the terrible decisions, past and present, of "modern" UI driven almost completely by shady marketing tactics encouraged and often forced by business. I certainly don't have the desire to do so without compensation to offset that stress.

magashna 7y ago

So the answer is to make it even more obscure?

rchaud 7y ago

Given the state of civics education in many parts of the country, a significant portion of people may not know how laws are passed. That doesn't give governments carte blanche to start passing laws in secret, because "people already don't know how it works".