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,,100km range fits the commuting needs of 95% of the people in western Europe’’ More like 95% of commuting needs of 95% of the people. As local transport is q

,,100km range fits the commuting needs of 95% of the people in western Europe’’ More like 95% of commuting needs of 95% of the people. As local transport is quite good, vacation is the more important and harder to substitute part of the car need.

wongarsu 7y ago
The car isn't going to make a trip to Italy for vacation. On the other hand drive to their vacation a lot less than in the 70s or 80s since flying became much cheaper. Also lots of families have two cars to manage commute, and one of those doesn't really need more range than necessary for the commute.
adrianN 7y ago
Vacation is the trivially substitutable part of car needs: Just rent a car.
- abyssin 7y ago
  I don't understand why this needs to be said, and I agree with you. There's no point owning a car that is more expensive only because if has to face specific conditions one or two days a year. Renting a car seems to be the obvious solution, but there might be two reasons why it doesn't appear to be so for most people. The first one is that in general car drivers don't know how much they pay per day or per kilometer driven. Then renting a car seems to be expensive. The second reason is that cars have an almost religious status in our society. It reminds me of Ath, a city in Belgium that has a yearly event where the people go through the streets wearing huge statues. This tradition can be found in other countries as well: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigantes_y_cabezudos https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigantes_y_cabezudos. Car culture looks like a big daily procession to honour the values of power, speed, and freedom from physical limitations. No wonder some people can't leave their symbolic attire, and instead want to own it, the way they own their daily clothes.
  - LeonM 7y ago
    It's even worse than that: in countries where caravans are popular (which is most of Europe), most people buy heavy and overpowered cars just to be able to tow their caravan twice a year.
- TomMarius 7y ago
  In Europe people often buy second hand cars for less than $5k, even less than $2k. Renting is way too expensive, as is this conversion kit.
  - adrianN 7y ago
    Pretty sure people everywhere buy second hand cars, but somehow car makers still sell millions of new cars every month. Surely more people can afford this kind of electric conversion kit than a new electric car.
    - TomMarius 7y ago
      Yeah but I'm pretty sure that most of those here who use cars to go to cities are those with low cost second hand cars. The nice ones are usually sitting parked in garages, used mainly for out of city or whole family trips - public transport is actually being used a lot here, however the current issue is that it doesn't connect out of city areas well, forcing people living out of city to use cars to commute. Most new cars are sold to businesses. I think this does not apply to the US.
- on_and_off 7y ago
  Or travel by train.. France (and Europe) have a great railway system. You don't necessarily need a car to travel. And if you do, as you mentioned, just rent one.
de_watcher 7y ago
Yea, EU vacation is starting to be fine from 200km range if the car supports 40+kWh/h charging. You're tired and need to make a stop just when the car needs a recharge.
- xiphias2 7y ago
  Probably yes, I live in eastern Europe, and here most chargers are 22kW, but with 40kW I guess it wouldn’t be a problem.
- magicalhippo 7y ago
  Just did a weeks vacation in Norway, where I live, with my BMW i3 94Ah model. It has a tad over 200km range. The biggest issue was finding an available, working charger. Due to this, we didn't feel safe having less than 50km range when charging. Overall I estimate we spent about 40% of the total stopping time waiting for or finding an available charger. The main leg was a 350km drive we've done several times before, and due to the charging it took us an extra hour or so compared to previous years with our previous ICE car. Interestingly my girlfriend said she actually felt it was shorter, because the trip was broken up by the longish charging stops. We also felt much less exhausted when we arrived. I'm sure charging will get better with time though. Increasing range will help a lot, and more charging stations will be built.

wongarsu 7y ago

The car isn't going to make a trip to Italy for vacation. On the other hand drive to their vacation a lot less than in the 70s or 80s since flying became much cheaper. Also lots of families have two cars to manage commute, and one of those doesn't really need more range than necessary for the commute.

adrianN 7y ago

Vacation is the trivially substitutable part of car needs: Just rent a car.

abyssin 7y ago
I don't understand why this needs to be said, and I agree with you. There's no point owning a car that is more expensive only because if has to face specific conditions one or two days a year. Renting a car seems to be the obvious solution, but there might be two reasons why it doesn't appear to be so for most people. The first one is that in general car drivers don't know how much they pay per day or per kilometer driven. Then renting a car seems to be expensive. The second reason is that cars have an almost religious status in our society. It reminds me of Ath, a city in Belgium that has a yearly event where the people go through the streets wearing huge statues. This tradition can be found in other countries as well: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigantes_y_cabezudos https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigantes_y_cabezudos. Car culture looks like a big daily procession to honour the values of power, speed, and freedom from physical limitations. No wonder some people can't leave their symbolic attire, and instead want to own it, the way they own their daily clothes.
- LeonM 7y ago
  It's even worse than that: in countries where caravans are popular (which is most of Europe), most people buy heavy and overpowered cars just to be able to tow their caravan twice a year.
TomMarius 7y ago
In Europe people often buy second hand cars for less than $5k, even less than $2k. Renting is way too expensive, as is this conversion kit.
- adrianN 7y ago
  Pretty sure people everywhere buy second hand cars, but somehow car makers still sell millions of new cars every month. Surely more people can afford this kind of electric conversion kit than a new electric car.
  - TomMarius 7y ago
    Yeah but I'm pretty sure that most of those here who use cars to go to cities are those with low cost second hand cars. The nice ones are usually sitting parked in garages, used mainly for out of city or whole family trips - public transport is actually being used a lot here, however the current issue is that it doesn't connect out of city areas well, forcing people living out of city to use cars to commute. Most new cars are sold to businesses. I think this does not apply to the US.
on_and_off 7y ago
Or travel by train.. France (and Europe) have a great railway system. You don't necessarily need a car to travel. And if you do, as you mentioned, just rent one.

de_watcher 7y ago

Yea, EU vacation is starting to be fine from 200km range if the car supports 40+kWh/h charging. You're tired and need to make a stop just when the car needs a recharge.

xiphias2 7y ago
Probably yes, I live in eastern Europe, and here most chargers are 22kW, but with 40kW I guess it wouldn’t be a problem.
magicalhippo 7y ago
Just did a weeks vacation in Norway, where I live, with my BMW i3 94Ah model. It has a tad over 200km range. The biggest issue was finding an available, working charger. Due to this, we didn't feel safe having less than 50km range when charging. Overall I estimate we spent about 40% of the total stopping time waiting for or finding an available charger. The main leg was a 350km drive we've done several times before, and due to the charging it took us an extra hour or so compared to previous years with our previous ICE car. Interestingly my girlfriend said she actually felt it was shorter, because the trip was broken up by the longish charging stops. We also felt much less exhausted when we arrived. I'm sure charging will get better with time though. Increasing range will help a lot, and more charging stations will be built.