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I aplaude the initiative, but I am skeptical about this. To convert and ICE car to electric you'll need a battery pack, BCM, inverter, motor, charger, heater c

by LeonM 7y ago

I aplaude the initiative, but I am skeptical about this. To convert and ICE car to electric you'll need a battery pack, BCM, inverter, motor, charger, heater core and mounting hardware at minimum. Even if they source all parts from the used market, I doubt they can do it for €5k. Then there is the practical part. Converting an ICE car to an electric drivetrain messes with weight distribution and crash safety. In most EU countries you'll need to do a full technical inspection to get the car road legal again (even if you used a certified kit). Air conditioning and most gauges in the dashboard will no longer work. And on most modern cars they'll need to do some serious software hacking to get the body control modules to accept the fact that there is no ECU anymore to talk to.

Reason077 7y ago
To address the later points (regulatory certification, ECU compatibility, etc), I think the point here is that they're designing kits to target specific popular models so that much of the work only needs to be done once per model. Once you have designed a set of compatible, tested parts, doing the conversion on a lot of similar vehicles becomes faster and cheaper compared to developing a bespoke solution each time. Not sure if they actually replace the ECU or just fake the missing inputs to keep the existing one happy. Either way, I'm sure they retain existing wiring and keep all the dashboard gauges working.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- LeonM 7y ago
  > I think the point here is that they're designing kits to target specific popular models so that much of the work only needs to be done once per model. I wasn't talking about type approval. In most EU countries (at least Germany and the Netherlands that I'm sure of) you need to pass through technical inspection if you modify a car. Especially if you change the fuel type or change the power output of the vehicle. > I'm sure they retain existing wiring and keep all the dashboard gauges working. Most gauges are no longer applicable (coolant temp, oil pressure, fuel level) or display the wrong range (the tachometer for instance).
  - Reason077 7y ago
    In EV conversions I've seen, the fuel gauge is typically repurposed to display battery state of charge, and the tachometer to display power output/regeneration. In modern cars these gauges are all controlled electronically, so it's not so difficult to make them display whatever you like by sending them different signals.
moviuro 7y ago
> I doubt they can do it for €5k. They don't. They do it for 8300€, of which 3300€ are (re)funded by the French tax office/Ecology Ministry. So it's 5000€ from the driver's pocket (in the end). See https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F32487 https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F32487 (in French)
- hokkos 7y ago
  It seems to use the conversion bonus where you discard an old fossil car to a new more efficient one, it can't use the EV bonus because it needs to be a new car, in this case this is a 5000€ bonus, if the law was changed to accept conversion it would make the whole thing free. https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F34014 https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F34014
- csours 7y ago
  That still seems way too cheap to me. A good battery pack would cost that much. And as someone else said, it's still an old(er) vehicle - any incident may lead to the vehicle being totaled from an insurance point of view. This may be OK for some consumers, but it could a big financial surprise to most.

by LeonM 7y ago

Reason077 7y ago

To address the later points (regulatory certification, ECU compatibility, etc), I think the point here is that they're designing kits to target specific popular models so that much of the work only needs to be done once per model. Once you have designed a set of compatible, tested parts, doing the conversion on a lot of similar vehicles becomes faster and cheaper compared to developing a bespoke solution each time. Not sure if they actually replace the ECU or just fake the missing inputs to keep the existing one happy. Either way, I'm sure they retain existing wiring and keep all the dashboard gauges working.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
LeonM 7y ago
> I think the point here is that they're designing kits to target specific popular models so that much of the work only needs to be done once per model. I wasn't talking about type approval. In most EU countries (at least Germany and the Netherlands that I'm sure of) you need to pass through technical inspection if you modify a car. Especially if you change the fuel type or change the power output of the vehicle. > I'm sure they retain existing wiring and keep all the dashboard gauges working. Most gauges are no longer applicable (coolant temp, oil pressure, fuel level) or display the wrong range (the tachometer for instance).
- Reason077 7y ago
  In EV conversions I've seen, the fuel gauge is typically repurposed to display battery state of charge, and the tachometer to display power output/regeneration. In modern cars these gauges are all controlled electronically, so it's not so difficult to make them display whatever you like by sending them different signals.

moviuro 7y ago

> I doubt they can do it for €5k. They don't. They do it for 8300€, of which 3300€ are (re)funded by the French tax office/Ecology Ministry. So it's 5000€ from the driver's pocket (in the end). See https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F32487 https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F32487 (in French)

hokkos 7y ago
It seems to use the conversion bonus where you discard an old fossil car to a new more efficient one, it can't use the EV bonus because it needs to be a new car, in this case this is a 5000€ bonus, if the law was changed to accept conversion it would make the whole thing free. https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F34014 https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F34014
csours 7y ago
That still seems way too cheap to me. A good battery pack would cost that much. And as someone else said, it's still an old(er) vehicle - any incident may lead to the vehicle being totaled from an insurance point of view. This may be OK for some consumers, but it could a big financial surprise to most.