6 ms·

If you want good software you simply have to pay more. These are small teams with no prior experience trying to do something huge, it makes sense to expect to p

If you want good software you simply have to pay more. These are small teams with no prior experience trying to do something huge, it makes sense to expect to pay even 5 times more if the direction of the project is good. Hopefully future versions will be cheaper as they learn and gain experience.

ThreeFx 7y ago
That was my motivation as well when I prepurchased the phone. Even though you might not get a $600 phone, Purism and the entire Linux community gain a lot of experience about the difficulties of designing hand-held hardware, applications and operating systems. In my opinion their progress has been fantastic, and I am quite excited for the future of Linux smartphones.
- TylerE 7y ago
  It isn't close to a $600 phone. The $180 Nokia 4.1 has near identical specs....except it has an 8 core, 2ghz CPU and not a 4 core, 1.5ghz cpu You can actually get under $100 if you compromise the specs just a little.
  - sverige 7y ago
    How much does it cost to keep everyone who wants to from gathering your personal data from that $100 phone, though?
    - joenathanone 7y ago
      Free if you know how to use ADB and Fastboot.
      - voltagex_ 7y ago
        So I checked, and there are no "official" current LineageOS builds for any Nokia phones (unless I'm missing something on https://download.lineageos.org https://download.lineageos.org) There don't seem to be any builds anywhere for the 4.1 (is it an uncommon phone?) For argument's sake, let's say you bought the 6.1, now your option is to download an "unofficial" ROM from some pseudo-anonymous person with an anime avatar from XDA, hosted on whatever free file hosting they can find today. Don't get me wrong, I used Lineage when it was called Cyanogenmod, and it saved one phone from landfill which is great. But I'm older now, and I need my phone to work and work well - I really don't have time for problems like https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?s=76595163ac856ff689bfa6cfcac15e4e&p=78883626&postcount=7 https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?s=76595163ac85.... For some people, that's worth the money. Edit: here's all the proprietary blobs that'd need to be reversed to be audited to make sure they're not selling you out, too - https://github.com/nokia-dev/proprietary_vendor_nokia/tree/android-9.0/sdm660-common/proprietary/lib64 https://github.com/nokia-dev/proprietary_vendor_nokia/tree/a.... Props to HMD for publishing them, though.
        bscphil 7y ago
        Similarly, I've pretty much given up on LineageOS ever getting the Nexus 5X to the 16.0 version. Their list of supported phones looks decent, but when you realize they can't keep even those phones up to date the project starts to look like a failure. I'm hoping to find an alternative for friends and family who still have the 5X - it's been dropped from Google's security updates for a while, because their support ends abysmally quickly.
        voltagex_ 7y ago
        You hit the 5X jackpot - up to a certain manufacturing date, those phones were notorious for bootlooping and never working again. More on topic, the LineageOS support requires a volunteer maintaining a buildable tree for the phone, and testing will require the hardware itself. I'm not sure how much CI/CD helps here.
        bscphil 7y ago
        You're right: of the four 5X phones owned by close friends or family, only 1 bootlooped (and one was stolen). It would be great to have continued support for the remaining phones, but planned obsolescence is too strong. The Nexus 5X supposedly has a maintainer with LineageOS, but maybe they're busy or no longer own the phone.
        tapia 7y ago
        Maybe try Ubuntu phone? [1] It is an officially supported device of UBports. [1] https://ubports.com/de_DE/devices/promoted-devices https://ubports.com/de_DE/devices/promoted-devices
        bscphil 7y ago
        Unfortunately, I believe the supported phone is the Nexus 5. The 5X is not a different version of the 5, it's the next generation of the smallest Nexus phone line, since the "6" was already taken. The numbering went Nexus 4, 5, 5X.
      - willtim 7y ago
        My time is not free
TylerE 7y ago
You're making the rather giant assumption that the software is good - where good means something besides "open".
wayneftw 7y ago
Yes, who complain that the software might not be that great, but who also want freedom, your option would be to buy without expectations as a way of donating to the project or to simply donate money directly to the project. That's the great thing about open source! People form groups and spend their own time/resources to build what they want instead of waiting around for the corporate big brother to build it.
- TylerE 7y ago
  Purism is a for-profit corporation. You aren't donating - any more than you're "donating" to Comcast when you pay your cable bill.
  - RandomBacon 7y ago
    Does Comcast support the Linux and "privacy" ecosystems?
  - burk96 7y ago
    You're correct, it's not a donation. However Purism right now is important in a way Comcast is not. Their work on the software side is making the GNU/Linux phone a reality and it will help both vendors and makers a like in the future. Supporting the company is indirectly supporting the GNU/Linux phone ecosystem and may be one of the best things to throw your money at right now to push development forward. On the Comcast side, they can get fucked. My whole city pays them a crazy high fee for internet and more a month with very little improvements being made in infrastructure. Sure they now a have a remote with voice commands, but I and most people I know are almost never near the advertised speeds. At least the latency is good.
  - jammygit 7y ago
    Purism is a social good corporation. It changes things a bit, but I’m unclear how
    - giaour 7y ago
      B corps are allowed to prioritize specific values enumerated in their corporate charter, even at the expense financial gains. Regular corporations have a fiduciary duty to their shareholders, which in recent decades has been interpreted as requiring companies to maximize short-term shareholder value

ThreeFx 7y ago

That was my motivation as well when I prepurchased the phone. Even though you might not get a $600 phone, Purism and the entire Linux community gain a lot of experience about the difficulties of designing hand-held hardware, applications and operating systems. In my opinion their progress has been fantastic, and I am quite excited for the future of Linux smartphones.

TylerE 7y ago
It isn't close to a $600 phone. The $180 Nokia 4.1 has near identical specs....except it has an 8 core, 2ghz CPU and not a 4 core, 1.5ghz cpu You can actually get under $100 if you compromise the specs just a little.
- sverige 7y ago
  How much does it cost to keep everyone who wants to from gathering your personal data from that $100 phone, though?
  - joenathanone 7y ago
    Free if you know how to use ADB and Fastboot.
    - voltagex_ 7y ago
      So I checked, and there are no "official" current LineageOS builds for any Nokia phones (unless I'm missing something on https://download.lineageos.org https://download.lineageos.org) There don't seem to be any builds anywhere for the 4.1 (is it an uncommon phone?) For argument's sake, let's say you bought the 6.1, now your option is to download an "unofficial" ROM from some pseudo-anonymous person with an anime avatar from XDA, hosted on whatever free file hosting they can find today. Don't get me wrong, I used Lineage when it was called Cyanogenmod, and it saved one phone from landfill which is great. But I'm older now, and I need my phone to work and work well - I really don't have time for problems like https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?s=76595163ac856ff689bfa6cfcac15e4e&p=78883626&postcount=7 https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?s=76595163ac85.... For some people, that's worth the money. Edit: here's all the proprietary blobs that'd need to be reversed to be audited to make sure they're not selling you out, too - https://github.com/nokia-dev/proprietary_vendor_nokia/tree/android-9.0/sdm660-common/proprietary/lib64 https://github.com/nokia-dev/proprietary_vendor_nokia/tree/a.... Props to HMD for publishing them, though.
      - bscphil 7y ago
        Similarly, I've pretty much given up on LineageOS ever getting the Nexus 5X to the 16.0 version. Their list of supported phones looks decent, but when you realize they can't keep even those phones up to date the project starts to look like a failure. I'm hoping to find an alternative for friends and family who still have the 5X - it's been dropped from Google's security updates for a while, because their support ends abysmally quickly.
        voltagex_ 7y ago
        You hit the 5X jackpot - up to a certain manufacturing date, those phones were notorious for bootlooping and never working again. More on topic, the LineageOS support requires a volunteer maintaining a buildable tree for the phone, and testing will require the hardware itself. I'm not sure how much CI/CD helps here.
        bscphil 7y ago
        You're right: of the four 5X phones owned by close friends or family, only 1 bootlooped (and one was stolen). It would be great to have continued support for the remaining phones, but planned obsolescence is too strong. The Nexus 5X supposedly has a maintainer with LineageOS, but maybe they're busy or no longer own the phone.
        tapia 7y ago
        Maybe try Ubuntu phone? [1] It is an officially supported device of UBports. [1] https://ubports.com/de_DE/devices/promoted-devices https://ubports.com/de_DE/devices/promoted-devices
        bscphil 7y ago
        Unfortunately, I believe the supported phone is the Nexus 5. The 5X is not a different version of the 5, it's the next generation of the smallest Nexus phone line, since the "6" was already taken. The numbering went Nexus 4, 5, 5X.
    - willtim 7y ago
      My time is not free

TylerE 7y ago

You're making the rather giant assumption that the software is good - where good means something besides "open".

wayneftw 7y ago

Yes, who complain that the software might not be that great, but who also want freedom, your option would be to buy without expectations as a way of donating to the project or to simply donate money directly to the project. That's the great thing about open source! People form groups and spend their own time/resources to build what they want instead of waiting around for the corporate big brother to build it.

TylerE 7y ago
Purism is a for-profit corporation. You aren't donating - any more than you're "donating" to Comcast when you pay your cable bill.
- RandomBacon 7y ago
  Does Comcast support the Linux and "privacy" ecosystems?
- burk96 7y ago
  You're correct, it's not a donation. However Purism right now is important in a way Comcast is not. Their work on the software side is making the GNU/Linux phone a reality and it will help both vendors and makers a like in the future. Supporting the company is indirectly supporting the GNU/Linux phone ecosystem and may be one of the best things to throw your money at right now to push development forward. On the Comcast side, they can get fucked. My whole city pays them a crazy high fee for internet and more a month with very little improvements being made in infrastructure. Sure they now a have a remote with voice commands, but I and most people I know are almost never near the advertised speeds. At least the latency is good.
- jammygit 7y ago
  Purism is a social good corporation. It changes things a bit, but I’m unclear how
  - giaour 7y ago
    B corps are allowed to prioritize specific values enumerated in their corporate charter, even at the expense financial gains. Regular corporations have a fiduciary duty to their shareholders, which in recent decades has been interpreted as requiring companies to maximize short-term shareholder value