4 ms·

Consequence of food choices purely based on taste, looks & colours? Edit: Forcing poor towards unhealthy food choices.

tyfon 7y ago
Also price. I don't think it's as bad here as in the US, however I see more and more of this type of foods in the store and it's usually quite cheap compared to food made from fresh produce at home. And this should really be an alarm bell as there is far less processing needed for fresh foods and it should be cheaper. Personally I stay away from them and make almost all of my food from scratch. It seems quite scary to radically change the diet of the human in this way in so short of a time.
- benrbray 7y ago
  I think there's something missing from the equation and I'm not sure what. In Tokyo, for example, I'm astonished by the amount of cheap, fresh food is available at grocery and convenience stores. Certain items (like imported fruits) are more expensive than in the US, but locally-produced vegetables / meats / etc seem to be widely available. It's possible that Tokyo is an example where due to the high density of people / restaurants, the "economy of scale" takes over and makes good food much cheaper. I might go one step further and make the claim that fresh food is so expensive in the US precisely because infrastructure is designed for cars, rather than people.
  - nicoburns 7y ago
    > It's possible that Tokyo is an example where due to the high density of people / restaurants, the "economy of scale" takes over and makes good food much cheaper. I don't think it's just Tokyo, you get this all across Europe too. I think there might be an economy of scale just in the fact that almost everyone in Japan/Europe buys fresh food as the primary component of their diet. I live in the UK, and the idea that you could live somewhere where there isn't a local (aka walking distance) grocery store or supermarket that sells reasonably priced fresh produce is completely alien to me (if you live a rural area, then I suppose you might have to drive, but then you would need to do that to get to any shop at all).
- humanrebar 7y ago
  > ...there is far less processing needed for fresh foods and it should be cheaper. Fresh food has significantly higher storage and shipping costs. It tends to go bad. You can reasonably expect to sell a pallet of mustard before any of it expires. How much of a pallet of bananas will end up unsellable?
  - kaybe 7y ago
    Frozen vegetables and fruit can work pretty well too. Some will have a different texture after thawing (eg berries) and cannot be used for everything but in cooking it's almost the same as fresh. How is the frozen food situation in the US?
    - Junk_Collector 7y ago
      Preserved fruits and vegetables are extremely cheap and available in the US. Food in general of any type is actually very cheap in the US unless you live in NYC or downtown SF. These prices are for average chain grocers, HEB, Krogers, Wegmans, etc. Not bulk shops like Sam's or Costco. Some grocers also tend to focus on lower costs and will be cheaper than this such as Fiesta. Frozen typically runs between $1 and $2 a lb depending on what you want. Some cheaper mixes can be had around $0.50/lb. Canned typically comes in between $0.25 and $1.00 a can depending on brand. The chain grocer near me also routinely has sales on canned vegetables for $0.15/can if you buy 20 or more. A can is typically about 15 ounces. It can make up the bulk of a meal for 1 person, or serve as a side for about 3. Dried bulk products such as rice or pinto beans are also reasonably cheap though more expensive now than they used to be. Beans run about $0.25 to $0.50/lb depending on how much you buy at once and rice is about half of that. Fresh produce varies a lot by time of year and location but can typically be had for under $1/lb if you aren't choosey. Double to triple for anything labeled organic. Meats start around $1 to $2/lb for chicken thighs and pork shoulder and goes up to about $20/lb for premium beef cuts. I routinely make stuffed bellpeppers (bell pepper, rice, hamburger, tomato, and spices) for lunch and then end cost comes out to around $1.50/lb.
  - tyfon 7y ago
    I think some of the reason is that we have become pickier. Most of the food that is counted "bad" is not really, like apples that have shrunk a bit. You can use them perfectly for something like an apple pie or ingredients in a dish. Fish is an issue because it can become "fishy", i.e. you get a strong taste of fish blood if not kept properly. I try to buy them from companies that freeze on the boat and transport around in trucks and sell directly to people. Most meats though is usually better tasting after the expiration date (to a certain extent!) But none of that can last for years in storage, I guess that lowers the cost a bit. Also the processed foods have more filler ingredients like corn starch etc which is cheap.
dpau 7y ago
An increasingly large percentage of Americans live in "food deserts" where the only options are small convenience stores or somewhat larger Dollar Generals where there are no fresh foods except perhaps milk and eggs. We can blame people for making bad decisions but a lot of times the only decision they can make is between one package and another..
- spaceisballer 7y ago
  You make a great point, plus in the US we use fast food as a substitute for a lot of meals. It’s been eye opening once you start looking at ingredients, made me rethink what we feed our kids.

Also price. I don't think it's as bad here as in the US, however I see more and more of this type of foods in the store and it's usually quite cheap compared to food made from fresh produce at home. And this should really be an alarm bell as there is far less processing needed for fresh foods and it should be cheaper. Personally I stay away from them and make almost all of my food from scratch. It seems quite scary to radically change the diet of the human in this way in so short of a time.

benrbray 7y ago
I think there's something missing from the equation and I'm not sure what. In Tokyo, for example, I'm astonished by the amount of cheap, fresh food is available at grocery and convenience stores. Certain items (like imported fruits) are more expensive than in the US, but locally-produced vegetables / meats / etc seem to be widely available. It's possible that Tokyo is an example where due to the high density of people / restaurants, the "economy of scale" takes over and makes good food much cheaper. I might go one step further and make the claim that fresh food is so expensive in the US precisely because infrastructure is designed for cars, rather than people.
- nicoburns 7y ago
  > It's possible that Tokyo is an example where due to the high density of people / restaurants, the "economy of scale" takes over and makes good food much cheaper. I don't think it's just Tokyo, you get this all across Europe too. I think there might be an economy of scale just in the fact that almost everyone in Japan/Europe buys fresh food as the primary component of their diet. I live in the UK, and the idea that you could live somewhere where there isn't a local (aka walking distance) grocery store or supermarket that sells reasonably priced fresh produce is completely alien to me (if you live a rural area, then I suppose you might have to drive, but then you would need to do that to get to any shop at all).
humanrebar 7y ago
> ...there is far less processing needed for fresh foods and it should be cheaper. Fresh food has significantly higher storage and shipping costs. It tends to go bad. You can reasonably expect to sell a pallet of mustard before any of it expires. How much of a pallet of bananas will end up unsellable?
- kaybe 7y ago
  Frozen vegetables and fruit can work pretty well too. Some will have a different texture after thawing (eg berries) and cannot be used for everything but in cooking it's almost the same as fresh. How is the frozen food situation in the US?
  - Junk_Collector 7y ago
    Preserved fruits and vegetables are extremely cheap and available in the US. Food in general of any type is actually very cheap in the US unless you live in NYC or downtown SF. These prices are for average chain grocers, HEB, Krogers, Wegmans, etc. Not bulk shops like Sam's or Costco. Some grocers also tend to focus on lower costs and will be cheaper than this such as Fiesta. Frozen typically runs between $1 and $2 a lb depending on what you want. Some cheaper mixes can be had around $0.50/lb. Canned typically comes in between $0.25 and $1.00 a can depending on brand. The chain grocer near me also routinely has sales on canned vegetables for $0.15/can if you buy 20 or more. A can is typically about 15 ounces. It can make up the bulk of a meal for 1 person, or serve as a side for about 3. Dried bulk products such as rice or pinto beans are also reasonably cheap though more expensive now than they used to be. Beans run about $0.25 to $0.50/lb depending on how much you buy at once and rice is about half of that. Fresh produce varies a lot by time of year and location but can typically be had for under $1/lb if you aren't choosey. Double to triple for anything labeled organic. Meats start around $1 to $2/lb for chicken thighs and pork shoulder and goes up to about $20/lb for premium beef cuts. I routinely make stuffed bellpeppers (bell pepper, rice, hamburger, tomato, and spices) for lunch and then end cost comes out to around $1.50/lb.
- tyfon 7y ago
  I think some of the reason is that we have become pickier. Most of the food that is counted "bad" is not really, like apples that have shrunk a bit. You can use them perfectly for something like an apple pie or ingredients in a dish. Fish is an issue because it can become "fishy", i.e. you get a strong taste of fish blood if not kept properly. I try to buy them from companies that freeze on the boat and transport around in trucks and sell directly to people. Most meats though is usually better tasting after the expiration date (to a certain extent!) But none of that can last for years in storage, I guess that lowers the cost a bit. Also the processed foods have more filler ingredients like corn starch etc which is cheap.

dpau 7y ago

An increasingly large percentage of Americans live in "food deserts" where the only options are small convenience stores or somewhat larger Dollar Generals where there are no fresh foods except perhaps milk and eggs. We can blame people for making bad decisions but a lot of times the only decision they can make is between one package and another..

spaceisballer 7y ago
You make a great point, plus in the US we use fast food as a substitute for a lot of meals. It’s been eye opening once you start looking at ingredients, made me rethink what we feed our kids.