2 ms·

It's not free - the thing you're not seeing here is that if you don't qualify for the continued "free-ness" of BizSpark (meaning re-upping), then you need to bu

It's not free - the thing you're not seeing here is that if you don't qualify for the continued "free-ness" of BizSpark (meaning re-upping), then you need to buy an MSDN license and make sure that your dev staff is covered appropriately with those licenses. You CANNOT run production SQL on an MSDN license - neither can you run a web server on an MSDN licensed version of Windows Server. Well, you literally can but you'd be in violation. It's not FREE. Microsoft doesn't make software to give it out to anyone claiming they're a startup. Read the entire FAQ in its entirety, then understand the licensing for web servers and web data servers - you'll quickly see that you'll need to enroll in other programs (ISV or otherwise) to get the discounts.

kenjackson 16y ago
Rob you continue to appear to lie on this thread (or are using very sophisticated doubletalk). The devtools are free. You never need to purchase another MSDN license if the current toolset does the job. Quote me a single line that says thay the dev tools you have a license to must be purchased after BizSpark.
- robconery 16y ago
  I don't mind having a discussion about this stuff, but calling me a liar is a bit out of bounds. Now - here's the thing: I've said the same thing 5 times, and you refuse to see it - which is that the software isn't free. The dev tools are covered under MSDN - so yes I'll give you that. And you can engineer it so that your dev team stays very small and you don't need to purchase additional slots. But that's where it stops. If you run the MS stack with VS, you'll need IIS, SQL Server, and all the other bits that go with it. These are the money-making SKUs friend - and that's my point. They. Aren't. Free. So which is it? Devtools? Or can I build $50B Google for free, as you said above. Double talk indeed.
  - kenjackson 16y ago
    Again, something that is simply not true. I don't have another way to say it, but to say that it is not true, and it gives the appearance of lying, because I think most people would expect you to know better. So again, you do get licensed production servers for free. Not an unlimited number of them, but you do get FREE production licenses of WinServer (which includes IIS) and SQL Server. And yes, you can build, in theory, $50B Google for free with it. Of course, I did say, in theory, and I make it blisteringly clear later when I say, "although you'll just have to write a very efficient backend to handle the transactions with only a couple of SQL instances, but there is nothing stopping you, but your ingenuity". There's never an obligation to pay MS a dime. You can use the tools to write the new BigTable, to write a web server, a NoSql engine, a package manager or whatever else you like as well to compliment the free software you have. IMO, I think we've done the job w/ this conversation. You've made the "claim" that BizSpark is not free (although you've backed away from this a bit and now at least seem to grant that the dev tools are). I claim otherwise. BizSpark very clearly calls out what is free and what is perpetual. Sure, you don't get a washer and dryer with BizSpark, but they never said you did. Likewise, I don't believe BizSpark gives you a free Kinect either. But it is very clear what they do give you and the licensing and cost associated with it. Again, you haven't pointed out where I'd have to pay for a single thing with BizSpark. You've only pointed out that if I want to do MORE than what BizSpark suggests, I'd have to pay. To that I say, duh.

kenjackson 16y ago

Rob you continue to appear to lie on this thread (or are using very sophisticated doubletalk). The devtools are free. You never need to purchase another MSDN license if the current toolset does the job. Quote me a single line that says thay the dev tools you have a license to must be purchased after BizSpark.

robconery 16y ago
I don't mind having a discussion about this stuff, but calling me a liar is a bit out of bounds. Now - here's the thing: I've said the same thing 5 times, and you refuse to see it - which is that the software isn't free. The dev tools are covered under MSDN - so yes I'll give you that. And you can engineer it so that your dev team stays very small and you don't need to purchase additional slots. But that's where it stops. If you run the MS stack with VS, you'll need IIS, SQL Server, and all the other bits that go with it. These are the money-making SKUs friend - and that's my point. They. Aren't. Free. So which is it? Devtools? Or can I build $50B Google for free, as you said above. Double talk indeed.
- kenjackson 16y ago
  Again, something that is simply not true. I don't have another way to say it, but to say that it is not true, and it gives the appearance of lying, because I think most people would expect you to know better. So again, you do get licensed production servers for free. Not an unlimited number of them, but you do get FREE production licenses of WinServer (which includes IIS) and SQL Server. And yes, you can build, in theory, $50B Google for free with it. Of course, I did say, in theory, and I make it blisteringly clear later when I say, "although you'll just have to write a very efficient backend to handle the transactions with only a couple of SQL instances, but there is nothing stopping you, but your ingenuity". There's never an obligation to pay MS a dime. You can use the tools to write the new BigTable, to write a web server, a NoSql engine, a package manager or whatever else you like as well to compliment the free software you have. IMO, I think we've done the job w/ this conversation. You've made the "claim" that BizSpark is not free (although you've backed away from this a bit and now at least seem to grant that the dev tools are). I claim otherwise. BizSpark very clearly calls out what is free and what is perpetual. Sure, you don't get a washer and dryer with BizSpark, but they never said you did. Likewise, I don't believe BizSpark gives you a free Kinect either. But it is very clear what they do give you and the licensing and cost associated with it. Again, you haven't pointed out where I'd have to pay for a single thing with BizSpark. You've only pointed out that if I want to do MORE than what BizSpark suggests, I'd have to pay. To that I say, duh.