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Wasn't this the struggle Musk signed up for? He said he wanted to reduce the cost of electric vehicles.. and he's doing it. Who was surprised that people would

Wasn't this the struggle Musk signed up for? He said he wanted to reduce the cost of electric vehicles.. and he's doing it. Who was surprised that people would purchase a cheaper version is available? I'm sure there are also lots of people buying one because it's finally in their budget... complaining they won't buy a more expensive version is like asking Corolla owners why they won't buy a Lexus instead. I'm not a musk fanboy.. but I don't think Musk is surprised here. Maybe the author of this article is surprised because he wasn't paying attention. And yeah, they have some quotes from investors.. but if they were surprised by this, then maybe they shouldn't be investing in things they don't care to analyze or think about more than 5 minutes.

pbreit 7y ago
This is the "Master Plan" Elon outlined 13 years ago so it's curious that 2 articles would come out today (this and one from WSJ) with the exact same misunderstanding. https://www.tesla.com/blog/secret-tesla-motors-master-plan-just-between-you-and-me https://www.tesla.com/blog/secret-tesla-motors-master-plan-j...
- Cshelton 7y ago
  It's not really curious at all. I've been a Tesla investor since the IPO and continue to buy on the "dips". Hasn't failed me yet. Tesla has enjoyed a very solid two week bull run. The shorts are hurting, and right on queue, the very peculiar articles come out. Bloomberg has put out many Tesla articles. Same with Business Insider, who just yesterday ran an article of "Man, driving a Tesla, runs a red light. Killing two pedestrians." ... How is that news? Had it been any other vehicle, the vehicle model would not have been named and it would not be NATIONAL news. I'm also on my second Tesla. You could offer me a Ferrari/Lambo/whatever, I'm keeping the Tesla.
  - thinkloop 7y ago
    Absolutely, Tesla has always had the oddest coverage, whether positive or negative, I rarely feel an article about them is unbiased - there's just too much money slushing around.
    - wpietri 7y ago
      I think Tesla is also unique in the extent to which Musk has pursued a high-visibility strategy. If you look at total sales, Tesla isn't even close to being in the top 20: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_manufacturers_by_motor_vehicle_production https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_manufacturers_by_motor... So it's unsurprising to me that people will write articles about pedestrians getting killed by a Tesla. I think that would happen even if Tesla hadn't been talking up "Autopilot", autonomous driving, etc. But with those being prominently discussed, it's guaranteed people will find Tesla crashes interesting.
      - gtirloni 7y ago
        Agreed. They should probably dial down the marketing a bit and get their heads down on creating more amazing things and let that do the talking. At some point, it must be too distracting at all levels.
        wpietri 7y ago
        That's my personal comfort zone, but I think it's far too late for that now. I think Musk has talked both investor and consumer expectations into the stratosphere. That has given him low cost of capital and extremely low marketing costs relative to other car producers. But now he's in the position of Wile E. Coyote running himself on thin air over a chasm. If he keeps running, he might make it to the other side. But it not, I don't think he falls slowly.
  - x0x0 7y ago
    I think part of it is Musk's braggadocio around the "Autopilot".
    - randycupertino 7y ago
      Not to mention the "autopilot" is fake self driving cars to skirt regulatory enforcement to get Tesla more data to collect and be first to market etc. It's so easy to jam it and cruise around typing emails or doing your makeup etc. Word is out I know someone who practices her flute on autopilot.
  - carlivar 7y ago
    If the Toyota CEO drove without hands on the wheel on national television and bragged about robotaxis and self driving, Toyotas would start joining Tesla accidents in the news, too.
gamblor956 7y ago
Tesla does not yet produce cars cheaper than their rivals. Tesla say they do but reach this metric only by leaving out financial items that all other automakers include in unit costing. If those same items were excluded with respect to the Chevy Bolt/Volt or BMW i3, or Jaguar iPace, then those cars are also fantastically profitable as well--even more so than any Tesla model.
- rgbrenner 7y ago
  That's true.. but I'm just comparing tesla with other tesla models. If you were in the market for a leaf, you were probably never considering a model x/s. But you make a good point.. there are now more luxury electric cars.. and those people are the same people that would buy a model x/s. Perhaps that's also part of why sales for those are lower.
  - threeseed 7y ago
    Model X/S sales are dropping for two reasons. Firstly they haven't been refreshed in forever and secondly they are being cannibalised by the Model 3. The problem for Tesla (and investors) is that their ARPU is now dropping at a time when they need margins.
    - luckydata 7y ago
      The Model X is a profoundly stupid car that needs a redesign now. The model S is just old but still a very enjoyable car, a minor face-lift and some love and care to the interiors should do the trick.
    - pmorici 7y ago
      Model S&X were both updated in spring 2019.
      - m463 7y ago
        I think pre-purchase folks "see" two model S cars, and one model X. (yes, get more familiar with them and the model S breaks down further in regard to AP and motors and battery sizes, but buyers aren't readily familiar with the distinctions until they do quite a bit of research)
m463 7y ago
What people don't see is that he's pretty much playing a game of starcraft (or a similar RTS). He's not showing amazing profitability because he's pouring so much into building his tech tree. When the competitors finally build their base and start pumping out zerglings, they might just encounter these battle cruisers coming out of the fog of war...
- carlivar 7y ago
  Then why is their CapEx spend so low?

pbreit 7y ago

This is the "Master Plan" Elon outlined 13 years ago so it's curious that 2 articles would come out today (this and one from WSJ) with the exact same misunderstanding. https://www.tesla.com/blog/secret-tesla-motors-master-plan-just-between-you-and-me https://www.tesla.com/blog/secret-tesla-motors-master-plan-j...

Cshelton 7y ago
It's not really curious at all. I've been a Tesla investor since the IPO and continue to buy on the "dips". Hasn't failed me yet. Tesla has enjoyed a very solid two week bull run. The shorts are hurting, and right on queue, the very peculiar articles come out. Bloomberg has put out many Tesla articles. Same with Business Insider, who just yesterday ran an article of "Man, driving a Tesla, runs a red light. Killing two pedestrians." ... How is that news? Had it been any other vehicle, the vehicle model would not have been named and it would not be NATIONAL news. I'm also on my second Tesla. You could offer me a Ferrari/Lambo/whatever, I'm keeping the Tesla.
- thinkloop 7y ago
  Absolutely, Tesla has always had the oddest coverage, whether positive or negative, I rarely feel an article about them is unbiased - there's just too much money slushing around.
  - wpietri 7y ago
    I think Tesla is also unique in the extent to which Musk has pursued a high-visibility strategy. If you look at total sales, Tesla isn't even close to being in the top 20: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_manufacturers_by_motor_vehicle_production https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_manufacturers_by_motor... So it's unsurprising to me that people will write articles about pedestrians getting killed by a Tesla. I think that would happen even if Tesla hadn't been talking up "Autopilot", autonomous driving, etc. But with those being prominently discussed, it's guaranteed people will find Tesla crashes interesting.
    - gtirloni 7y ago
      Agreed. They should probably dial down the marketing a bit and get their heads down on creating more amazing things and let that do the talking. At some point, it must be too distracting at all levels.
      - wpietri 7y ago
        That's my personal comfort zone, but I think it's far too late for that now. I think Musk has talked both investor and consumer expectations into the stratosphere. That has given him low cost of capital and extremely low marketing costs relative to other car producers. But now he's in the position of Wile E. Coyote running himself on thin air over a chasm. If he keeps running, he might make it to the other side. But it not, I don't think he falls slowly.
- x0x0 7y ago
  I think part of it is Musk's braggadocio around the "Autopilot".
  - randycupertino 7y ago
    Not to mention the "autopilot" is fake self driving cars to skirt regulatory enforcement to get Tesla more data to collect and be first to market etc. It's so easy to jam it and cruise around typing emails or doing your makeup etc. Word is out I know someone who practices her flute on autopilot.
- carlivar 7y ago
  If the Toyota CEO drove without hands on the wheel on national television and bragged about robotaxis and self driving, Toyotas would start joining Tesla accidents in the news, too.

gamblor956 7y ago

Tesla does not yet produce cars cheaper than their rivals. Tesla say they do but reach this metric only by leaving out financial items that all other automakers include in unit costing. If those same items were excluded with respect to the Chevy Bolt/Volt or BMW i3, or Jaguar iPace, then those cars are also fantastically profitable as well--even more so than any Tesla model.

rgbrenner 7y ago
That's true.. but I'm just comparing tesla with other tesla models. If you were in the market for a leaf, you were probably never considering a model x/s. But you make a good point.. there are now more luxury electric cars.. and those people are the same people that would buy a model x/s. Perhaps that's also part of why sales for those are lower.
- threeseed 7y ago
  Model X/S sales are dropping for two reasons. Firstly they haven't been refreshed in forever and secondly they are being cannibalised by the Model 3. The problem for Tesla (and investors) is that their ARPU is now dropping at a time when they need margins.
  - luckydata 7y ago
    The Model X is a profoundly stupid car that needs a redesign now. The model S is just old but still a very enjoyable car, a minor face-lift and some love and care to the interiors should do the trick.
  - pmorici 7y ago
    Model S&X were both updated in spring 2019.
    - m463 7y ago
      I think pre-purchase folks "see" two model S cars, and one model X. (yes, get more familiar with them and the model S breaks down further in regard to AP and motors and battery sizes, but buyers aren't readily familiar with the distinctions until they do quite a bit of research)

m463 7y ago

What people don't see is that he's pretty much playing a game of starcraft (or a similar RTS). He's not showing amazing profitability because he's pouring so much into building his tech tree. When the competitors finally build their base and start pumping out zerglings, they might just encounter these battle cruisers coming out of the fog of war...

carlivar 7y ago
Then why is their CapEx spend so low?