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Creative writing has an oversupply and underdemand problem. Most novels are self published. Most don't even sell three figures. For short fiction, there are hu
by sago 7y ago
Creative writing has an oversupply and underdemand problem.
Most novels are self published. Most don't even sell three figures. For short fiction, there are hundreds of literary magazines, and more appearing every day, but only a minority pay anything at all. In a niche such as poetry, the minority becomes vanishingly small.
MFAs churn out tens of thousands of credible writers every year, plus all the retirees (hai), midlife crises, career breakers, redundancy moneys, job hunters, stay-at-home parents, etc.
So by and large the industry doesn't deal with it. To a first order approximation, creative writing is a leisure pursuit.
- vinceguidry 7y agoAnyone looking to make money in creative writing should consider erotic literature. Erotic content on Patreon is a growing segment.
- dondawest 7y agoI thought Patreon specifically banned erotic content / porn?
- vinceguidry 7y agoThey're playing the game of trying to ban some of it but not all of it. For erotic literature specifically, they're trying to forbid certain genres. It's a weird cat and mouse game and I'm having trouble picking sides.
- vorpalhex 7y agoI'm generally upset at them over their weird ban-not-ban. I can understand they have to deal with credit card processors, etc - but please give the community clear guidelines and don't play the part of the censor.
- vinceguidry 7y agoI'm not certain there's a way out of it. On Quora I've been seeing pedophiles creating accounts with the intent on pushing boundaries. It's pretty disturbing seeing it taken out of a literary context. I don't envy Patreon's task here.
- dondawest 7y agoSuper interesting. Is there anywhere I can find a list of the allowed erotic genres vs the banned genres? Thanks.
- antupis 7y agoRomance novels sell pretty well also consider how much there are low-quality novels in market https://www.citylab.com/life/2018/01/freelancer-gig-economy-tips-for-success-romance-novelist/550631/ https://www.citylab.com/life/2018/01/freelancer-gig-economy-...
- komali2 7y agoYup. Come up with an amusing and obvious penname (Robert Harder, Felatia Organica, that kind of thing), and then start writing stories about people having sex with monsters/bears/dinosaurs. Crazy market for monster erotic literature. If you can find a way to convince furries to pay for your stuff then you've really got a goldmine. They've got tons of free fanfiction to work with though so that might be hard.
- throwaway123x2 7y agoAs someone who's considering turning to writing from tech, this hurts. It's probably true, but now I don't know how to handle my midlife crisis.
- circlefavshape 7y agoWrite as a leisure pursuit!
- sago 7y agoIf your motivation is commercial rather than leisure, I suspect the answer lies in what you already know from tech. It's about marketing. It's about finding a niche. It's about building an audience. It's about luck. It's about presentation. It's about finding a product market fit. It's about failing fast. And somewhere down the list of priorities, you'll need to be competent writer. Doing what everyone else is doing, and expecting to win by the sheer force of brilliance, is probably a bad plan. Fortunately, 99% of your competitors are following that plan. But it does kind of rely on you writing somewhat cynically. Rather than for love of art. With this huge caveat that I write for fun, so I'm pontificating. Take what I say with a cellar of salt.
- asark 7y agoAt least try it out before, say, quitting your day job. Submit some pieces, get some feedback, go through a few rounds of that. Don't do anything for free, that's horseshit and teaches/proves way less than selling some words. If your thing's literary fiction then LOL good luck, otherwise you'll probably be fine if you've got a bit of a knack for it, some patience to deal with the business side of it, and can follow directions.
- vidarh 7y agoWrite as a leisure pursuit as the sibling comment says, but also consider writing short <10k short episodic stuff and put it on Kindle. As an experiment I published something under a pseudonym (no, not telling you) that was thrown together a few years back largely to see how quickly I could do it, and a single work will only make you money if you're a fantastic writer and do a lot of work to market it (or get someone, like a publisher, to do it for you) But multiple shorter pieces gives more visibility and cross promotion opportunities, as if you're lucky your readers like one to go on to buy more, and the more you have on sale, the bigger the average payoff per converted fan becomes. It also lets you place it at a price point that is very low risk for people, and as you build up a back catalog you can further expand it by selling collections. My experiment didn't exactly pay great, but it did pay, and importantly it keeps selling in small numbers several years later. At this rate, in a few years my hourly pay for writing it will actually be decent... See that both as encouragement and a warning that this is not a "get rich quick" approach. I think if you want to commit to it but don't feel like being a starving writer on an elusive quest for a best seller, start writing short stuff (be it manuals, DIY guides, novellas, collections of poems are whatever you want) as a sideline and build up a back catalog and income stream from it. See every new thing you write as another tiny little sales vehicle for your full back catalog, rather than expect to get a sudden payday from every one thing. It keeps the commitment low - you can write as little or as much as you like - and it lets you build up an income stream until it seems realistic to make it your job as opposed to a side income.
- asark 7y agoWhat little pay remains in short fiction is almost all in genre fic. Not that there's a ton there, but there's way more than in literary fiction. Though even those are cutting editorial staff and want much more polished, nearly-publication-ready submissions these days, so brush up on your editing skills.
- circlefavshape 7y ago> To a first order approximation, creative writing is a leisure pursuit Writing music is the same ... though FWIW writing music is a really fun leisure pursuit
- bluescrn 7y agoGame development is heading in the same direction. Great fun as a hobby, but it’s getting ever harder to make a career out of it
- alehul 7y agoOn the idea of leisurely pursuits: "I must study politics and war, that our sons may have liberty to study mathematics and philosophy. Our sons ought to study mathematics and philosophy, geography, natural history and naval architecture, navigation, commerce and agriculture in order to give their children a right to study painting, poetry, music, architecture, statuary, tapestry and porcelain." — John Adams
- jamesjyu 7y agoIf anyone is curious about the short fiction market, I've been knee deep into that for the past year or so (coming from tech), I'm happy to chat and give advice. In short: do it for leisure, hobby, or the love of the craft.