6 ms·

That's you projecting what I mean by "illegals", while I'm just using official terminology. I do not have an opinion one way or the other regarding the app's ex

That's you projecting what I mean by "illegals", while I'm just using official terminology. I do not have an opinion one way or the other regarding the app's existence and motives.

geofft 7y ago
Official terminology is "illegal aliens" or "illegal immigrants." As people, they are not illegal: their alien status / immigration status is. (The law, I think, just uses the terms "illegal entry" / "unauthorized presence" / "inadmissible" / etc. and "illegal immigration" to describe the act in general. But USCIS, ICE, etc. do use the term "illegal alien.")
- siphon22 7y ago
  Sorry for not making sure to use the full term. My point was though, "illegal" is not a bad word and it's used officially.
  - Thorrez 7y ago
    It's not bad as an adjective. It's bad as a noun.
    - geofft 7y ago
      There is definitely a trend among US progressives to use "undocumented" instead of "illegal," even as an adjective, to avoid the connotation of illegal people. I tend to follow that personally (even though in many cases it's not technically accurate—"undocumented" folks often have regular checkins with ICE if there's no deportation order yet, while proceedings are in progress, and that process certainly generates a lot of documentation, and there's also programs like DACA) but I won't fault someone for using the official terminology in good faith.
1f60c 7y ago
…official terminology that is dehumanizing, then.
learnstats2 7y ago
official in what sense, please?
- siphon22 7y ago
  Legal is an acceptable term right? No one bats an eye at "Legal Resident". What's the opposite of legal? Illegal. As far as I think, these are just states and do not imply anything about the person in question. They are terms I assume used pretty ubiquitously in most places of the world with a government in different forms. Again, as far as I think, being somewhere illegally doesn't make you any lesser of a human than I am. But they are still here illegally. I could call them undocumented too, but they're still here illegally.
  - saagarjha 7y ago
    Nobody calls people “legals”.
  - learnstats2 7y ago
    Besides any other point - How many times have you described yourself (or have others described you) as "a legal"? I bet it's none, because you don't see that as a defining characteristic of yourself.
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That's you projecting what I mean by "illegals", while I'm just using official terminology. I do not have an opinion one way or the other regarding the app's existence and motives.

geofft 7y ago

Official terminology is "illegal aliens" or "illegal immigrants." As people, they are not illegal: their alien status / immigration status is. (The law, I think, just uses the terms "illegal entry" / "unauthorized presence" / "inadmissible" / etc. and "illegal immigration" to describe the act in general. But USCIS, ICE, etc. do use the term "illegal alien.")

siphon22 7y ago
Sorry for not making sure to use the full term. My point was though, "illegal" is not a bad word and it's used officially.
- Thorrez 7y ago
  It's not bad as an adjective. It's bad as a noun.
  - geofft 7y ago
    There is definitely a trend among US progressives to use "undocumented" instead of "illegal," even as an adjective, to avoid the connotation of illegal people. I tend to follow that personally (even though in many cases it's not technically accurate—"undocumented" folks often have regular checkins with ICE if there's no deportation order yet, while proceedings are in progress, and that process certainly generates a lot of documentation, and there's also programs like DACA) but I won't fault someone for using the official terminology in good faith.

1f60c 7y ago

…official terminology that is dehumanizing, then.

learnstats2 7y ago

official in what sense, please?

siphon22 7y ago
Legal is an acceptable term right? No one bats an eye at "Legal Resident". What's the opposite of legal? Illegal. As far as I think, these are just states and do not imply anything about the person in question. They are terms I assume used pretty ubiquitously in most places of the world with a government in different forms. Again, as far as I think, being somewhere illegally doesn't make you any lesser of a human than I am. But they are still here illegally. I could call them undocumented too, but they're still here illegally.
- saagarjha 7y ago
  Nobody calls people “legals”.
- learnstats2 7y ago
  Besides any other point - How many times have you described yourself (or have others described you) as "a legal"? I bet it's none, because you don't see that as a defining characteristic of yourself.

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