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This sounds like a noble tool, unless it's not. In the most cynical case, sharing your contacts and location via this app could make ICE's job much easier. Ho

by mLuby 7y ago

This sounds like a noble tool, unless it's not. In the most cynical case, sharing your contacts and location via this app could make ICE's job much easier. How can people tell which it is?

onemoresoop 7y ago
You think this could be a trap?
- cyphar 7y ago
  If I were a spook, it's definitely a technique I'd try (the FBI has run honeypots before). But other commenters have mentioned that it's run by a reputable group, so it's probably not a massive concern (then again we know that intelligence sharing occurs between the NSA and other agencies -- if I were ICE I'd ask the NSA to get information about the users of the app). I do imagine there is some legal red tape to get around if you actually want to use it as evidence in immigration investigations. Then again, you don't need to use it as evidence -- all you need is a lead and you can get all the evidence necessary when you detain them.
geofft 7y ago
The app is from United We Dream, which is well-known to not be on ICE's side. Of course, that doesn't account for possibilities like United We Dream being an elaborate ICE front (a la 1984's Brotherhood), the app developers being compromised by / secretly working for ICE, the app or its servers being compromised by ICE, etc.
- nerdponx 7y ago
  Small-scale compromise seems well within the realm of possibility.
- kortilla 7y ago
  Does United we dream have the security chops to understand all of the risks of using hosting/cloud services from companies that have to comply with US government secret court warrants? If this thing used anything like GCE or AWS that would be pretty negligent.
  - morpheuskafka 7y ago
    ICE can't apply for a FISA warrant or issue a National Security Letter and I'm pretty sure the intelligence agencies are not going to waste their time tracking down removable immigrants.
    - jfnixon 7y ago
      The IC has no problem supplying data to LE who then come up with parallel construction to justify the fruits. https://theintercept.com/2018/01/09/dark-side-fbi-dea-illegal-searches-secret-evidence/ https://theintercept.com/2018/01/09/dark-side-fbi-dea-illega...

by mLuby 7y ago

This sounds like a noble tool, unless it's not. In the most cynical case, sharing your contacts and location via this app could make ICE's job much easier. How can people tell which it is?

onemoresoop 7y ago

You think this could be a trap?

cyphar 7y ago
If I were a spook, it's definitely a technique I'd try (the FBI has run honeypots before). But other commenters have mentioned that it's run by a reputable group, so it's probably not a massive concern (then again we know that intelligence sharing occurs between the NSA and other agencies -- if I were ICE I'd ask the NSA to get information about the users of the app). I do imagine there is some legal red tape to get around if you actually want to use it as evidence in immigration investigations. Then again, you don't need to use it as evidence -- all you need is a lead and you can get all the evidence necessary when you detain them.

geofft 7y ago

The app is from United We Dream, which is well-known to not be on ICE's side. Of course, that doesn't account for possibilities like United We Dream being an elaborate ICE front (a la 1984's Brotherhood), the app developers being compromised by / secretly working for ICE, the app or its servers being compromised by ICE, etc.

nerdponx 7y ago
Small-scale compromise seems well within the realm of possibility.
kortilla 7y ago
Does United we dream have the security chops to understand all of the risks of using hosting/cloud services from companies that have to comply with US government secret court warrants? If this thing used anything like GCE or AWS that would be pretty negligent.
- morpheuskafka 7y ago
  ICE can't apply for a FISA warrant or issue a National Security Letter and I'm pretty sure the intelligence agencies are not going to waste their time tracking down removable immigrants.
  - jfnixon 7y ago
    The IC has no problem supplying data to LE who then come up with parallel construction to justify the fruits. https://theintercept.com/2018/01/09/dark-side-fbi-dea-illegal-searches-secret-evidence/ https://theintercept.com/2018/01/09/dark-side-fbi-dea-illega...