4 ms·

> prompting outrage when there isn't a good reason for it. Can you expand on why there's 'no good reason for it'? The equivalent is my peering in your window

> prompting outrage when there isn't a good reason for it. Can you expand on why there's 'no good reason for it'? The equivalent is my peering in your window to see and note down what you rub one out to... every time. And you don't know what I do with that information or where it will leak to. That sounds perfectly fine to you, does it?

aviraldg 7y ago
No, the equivalent is you walking into a store to buy DVDs, and the store manager keeping a record of what sells well, and what you show interest in, etc. to drive decisions about what to stock next.
- Yizahi 7y ago
  No, the equivalent is you walking into a store to buy DVDs, and the store manager of a nearby store keeping a record of what sells well, and what you show interest in, etc. to drive decisions about what to stock next.
- martingoodson 7y ago
  ... and then cross-referencing your purchase with everything else you ever purchased. And also every article you ever read. And then selling that information to others.
  - dsr_ 7y ago
    ... and claiming it's not a privacy violation because they don't let the others search for martingoodson, they just offer selection criteria including your age, gender, geographical location, inferred income, inferred religion, inferred skin color, and of course interests.
  - RandomInteger4 7y ago
    Can you show me an example of where and how Google or Facebook "sells your information?" i.e. allows others to view that information?
- Carstairs 7y ago
  That analogy only works if its only the store manager keeping the records. Whats really happening is the store manager is outsouring his record keeping to a 3rd party who has full access to the data from his store and data from millions of other stores too.
  - andromeduck 7y ago
    You mean like any big chain or conglomerate or Visa/MasterCard? Consulting/analytics isn't anything new for retail either.
- pjc50 7y ago
  Interestingly this example led to one of America's few, narrowly-focused privacy laws: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_Privacy_Protection_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_Privacy_Protection_Act > It makes any "video tape service provider" that discloses rental [or sale] information outside the ordinary course of business liable for up to $2500 in actual damages.
  - vageli 7y ago
    It's crazy, we understand that libraries should be barred from handing over our book checkout histories but somehow we allow corporations to do that and much more.
- letstrynvm 7y ago
  - the user didn't leave his home - he has an 'expectation of privacy' because the tracking is covert - he can't go to a different 'store'... the same covert tracking is in all of them pooling the information
aeroxis 7y ago
It is actually not like you peering through his window to see and note down what you rib one out. It's more like when I have a massive orgy with lots of drugs at my place and I invited a bouncer, who is really good at statistics, to keep track of who is coming in and who are leaving immediately. The bouncer is also keeping track of what each person is doing, and letting me know periodically. And you both are invited for a night of drug fueled insane sex. From my perspective, I am doing this to make sure everyone is having fun at my party. From the bouncer's perspective, he is there just to collect stats and let me know. He is not there to invade my privacy. I want to do that. I hired the bouncer. I think that is more is an accurate description.
- ysavir 7y ago
  What you forgot to mention was that the bouncer does this for free and has a day job publishing tabloids.
  - dhimes 7y ago
    And none of the other orgy participants understand this. And OP may not fully understand it either.
  - nemosaltat 7y ago
    My dads mantra used to be, “if it seems too good to be true, it probably is”. Now, I find I must consistently remind him- if it’s “free” (as in beer, not speech) you’re almost definitely paying for it.
    - TeMPOraL 7y ago
      Related, when consuming news, if the story seems to involve ridiculous levels of stupidity or malice, the truth is most likely much more mundane and much more reasonable.
  - everdrive 7y ago
    There's nothing I enjoy more than a bunch of nerds analyzing a metaphor to death.

aviraldg 7y ago

No, the equivalent is you walking into a store to buy DVDs, and the store manager keeping a record of what sells well, and what you show interest in, etc. to drive decisions about what to stock next.

Yizahi 7y ago
No, the equivalent is you walking into a store to buy DVDs, and the store manager of a nearby store keeping a record of what sells well, and what you show interest in, etc. to drive decisions about what to stock next.
martingoodson 7y ago
... and then cross-referencing your purchase with everything else you ever purchased. And also every article you ever read. And then selling that information to others.
- dsr_ 7y ago
  ... and claiming it's not a privacy violation because they don't let the others search for martingoodson, they just offer selection criteria including your age, gender, geographical location, inferred income, inferred religion, inferred skin color, and of course interests.
- RandomInteger4 7y ago
  Can you show me an example of where and how Google or Facebook "sells your information?" i.e. allows others to view that information?
Carstairs 7y ago
That analogy only works if its only the store manager keeping the records. Whats really happening is the store manager is outsouring his record keeping to a 3rd party who has full access to the data from his store and data from millions of other stores too.
- andromeduck 7y ago
  You mean like any big chain or conglomerate or Visa/MasterCard? Consulting/analytics isn't anything new for retail either.
pjc50 7y ago
Interestingly this example led to one of America's few, narrowly-focused privacy laws: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_Privacy_Protection_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_Privacy_Protection_Act > It makes any "video tape service provider" that discloses rental [or sale] information outside the ordinary course of business liable for up to $2500 in actual damages.
- vageli 7y ago
  It's crazy, we understand that libraries should be barred from handing over our book checkout histories but somehow we allow corporations to do that and much more.
letstrynvm 7y ago
- the user didn't leave his home - he has an 'expectation of privacy' because the tracking is covert - he can't go to a different 'store'... the same covert tracking is in all of them pooling the information

aeroxis 7y ago

It is actually not like you peering through his window to see and note down what you rib one out. It's more like when I have a massive orgy with lots of drugs at my place and I invited a bouncer, who is really good at statistics, to keep track of who is coming in and who are leaving immediately. The bouncer is also keeping track of what each person is doing, and letting me know periodically. And you both are invited for a night of drug fueled insane sex. From my perspective, I am doing this to make sure everyone is having fun at my party. From the bouncer's perspective, he is there just to collect stats and let me know. He is not there to invade my privacy. I want to do that. I hired the bouncer. I think that is more is an accurate description.

ysavir 7y ago
What you forgot to mention was that the bouncer does this for free and has a day job publishing tabloids.
- dhimes 7y ago
  And none of the other orgy participants understand this. And OP may not fully understand it either.
- nemosaltat 7y ago
  My dads mantra used to be, “if it seems too good to be true, it probably is”. Now, I find I must consistently remind him- if it’s “free” (as in beer, not speech) you’re almost definitely paying for it.
  - TeMPOraL 7y ago
    Related, when consuming news, if the story seems to involve ridiculous levels of stupidity or malice, the truth is most likely much more mundane and much more reasonable.
- everdrive 7y ago
  There's nothing I enjoy more than a bunch of nerds analyzing a metaphor to death.