4 ms·

Cronyism is found in all political systems and in some systems like fascism might even be considered a defining characteristic. People trying to manipulate the

by opo 7y ago

Cronyism is found in all political systems and in some systems like fascism might even be considered a defining characteristic. People trying to manipulate the political system for economic gain is unfortunately always going to happen whether there is little or a lot of economic freedom in the system. >...When capitalism produces outcomes they approve of, it's because capitalism is good. When capitalism produces outcomes they don't approve of, it's because what was going on wasn't really capitalism, it was its debased, photo-negative, bearded-Spock version, "crony capitalism." Can you give an example?

smacktoward 7y ago
Watch Fox News or listen to conservative talk radio for a couple of days, you'll have more examples than you know what to do with.
- opo 7y ago
  You said that "frequently" right wing media would mistakingly claim that any result they didn't like was "crony capitalism" when the issue in question would not fit the definition of crony capitalism. It is unfortunate that you don't have some links to examples if it does happen frequently.
  - SantalBlush 7y ago
    I've heard Peter Schiff blame "crony communism" on a radio show. I'll see if I can find a link after work. But it is true that the term is used as a scapegoat. It's not like you haven't heard the term before, so I'm not sure why you're asking for links.
    - opo 7y ago
      >...I've heard Peter Schiff blame "crony communism" on a radio show. That sounds like something different than the OP said. >...It's not like you haven't heard the term before, so I'm not sure why you're asking for links. It's like I said, cronyism will be found in any political system. What was odd, was the original poster was saying that frequently when people didn't like some result, it was blamed on "crony capitalism" and as the OP pointed out: >"Which is frustrating, because "crony capitalism" is a real thing that actually means something specific" I don't think I've seen examples of people in the media using the term "crony capitalism" wrong, but then again I don't watch Fox News, so I asked for an example. Does that make sense?
      - SantalBlush 7y ago
        Yes, that makes sense. But it also suggests to me that any example someone provides will be handwaved, so I'm not going to bother. At any rate, I agree with OP that it's used as a scapegoat.
orthecreedence 7y ago
Sure, bring up the 2008 crash to any pro-capitalist and they'll quickly explain to you how "oh that wasn't real capitalism" even though it happened in the confines of a system that self-describes as capitalist.
- opo 7y ago
  With the 2008 crash there is plenty of examples of incompetent/unethical/(possibly)illegal actions taken by government, industry and consumers that helped cause it. Also economists came up with many possible suggestions (often contradictory) to make the system better so it doesn't happen again. While the causes and recommended solutions to the great recession are still being debated, most people would say the mixed economy we have is capitalist. So I find it odd that someone would claim we didn't have a capitalist system in 2008. Can you give a link to an example?
  - winstonewert 7y ago
    Here's a link. It doesn't specifically address the 2008 crisis, but I think it does explain why some would say that America is not capitalist. https://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/bernie-not-socialist-america-not-capitalist https://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/bernie-not-soci... To summarize the issue: we have a mixed economy. We do not have what advocates of capitalism want: a purely capitalist economy (or at least something much closer to that). That's why they would say we do not have a capitalist economy.
    - opo 7y ago
      >...To summarize the issue: we have a mixed economy. We do not have what advocates of capitalism want: a purely capitalist econom ... I agree. I asked for an example in my message, since, as you point out I've never heard a "pro-capitalist" singling out the 2008 crisis as "oh that wasn't real capitalism". People might want to narrowly define the meaning of a capitalist economic system but that is a bit different than what it looked like the OP was writing.

by opo 7y ago

smacktoward 7y ago

Watch Fox News or listen to conservative talk radio for a couple of days, you'll have more examples than you know what to do with.

opo 7y ago
You said that "frequently" right wing media would mistakingly claim that any result they didn't like was "crony capitalism" when the issue in question would not fit the definition of crony capitalism. It is unfortunate that you don't have some links to examples if it does happen frequently.
- SantalBlush 7y ago
  I've heard Peter Schiff blame "crony communism" on a radio show. I'll see if I can find a link after work. But it is true that the term is used as a scapegoat. It's not like you haven't heard the term before, so I'm not sure why you're asking for links.
  - opo 7y ago
    >...I've heard Peter Schiff blame "crony communism" on a radio show. That sounds like something different than the OP said. >...It's not like you haven't heard the term before, so I'm not sure why you're asking for links. It's like I said, cronyism will be found in any political system. What was odd, was the original poster was saying that frequently when people didn't like some result, it was blamed on "crony capitalism" and as the OP pointed out: >"Which is frustrating, because "crony capitalism" is a real thing that actually means something specific" I don't think I've seen examples of people in the media using the term "crony capitalism" wrong, but then again I don't watch Fox News, so I asked for an example. Does that make sense?
    - SantalBlush 7y ago
      Yes, that makes sense. But it also suggests to me that any example someone provides will be handwaved, so I'm not going to bother. At any rate, I agree with OP that it's used as a scapegoat.

orthecreedence 7y ago

Sure, bring up the 2008 crash to any pro-capitalist and they'll quickly explain to you how "oh that wasn't real capitalism" even though it happened in the confines of a system that self-describes as capitalist.

opo 7y ago
With the 2008 crash there is plenty of examples of incompetent/unethical/(possibly)illegal actions taken by government, industry and consumers that helped cause it. Also economists came up with many possible suggestions (often contradictory) to make the system better so it doesn't happen again. While the causes and recommended solutions to the great recession are still being debated, most people would say the mixed economy we have is capitalist. So I find it odd that someone would claim we didn't have a capitalist system in 2008. Can you give a link to an example?
- winstonewert 7y ago
  Here's a link. It doesn't specifically address the 2008 crisis, but I think it does explain why some would say that America is not capitalist. https://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/bernie-not-socialist-america-not-capitalist https://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/bernie-not-soci... To summarize the issue: we have a mixed economy. We do not have what advocates of capitalism want: a purely capitalist economy (or at least something much closer to that). That's why they would say we do not have a capitalist economy.
  - opo 7y ago
    >...To summarize the issue: we have a mixed economy. We do not have what advocates of capitalism want: a purely capitalist econom ... I agree. I asked for an example in my message, since, as you point out I've never heard a "pro-capitalist" singling out the 2008 crisis as "oh that wasn't real capitalism". People might want to narrowly define the meaning of a capitalist economic system but that is a bit different than what it looked like the OP was writing.