7 ms·

I was gonna reply to defend the Macbook Pro, but then I realized the author is right, I did have to replace my Macbook Pro keyboard too because the spacebar key

I was gonna reply to defend the Macbook Pro, but then I realized the author is right, I did have to replace my Macbook Pro keyboard too because the spacebar key was stuck. But whatever, I am not gonna leave my macbook behind just because of that. By comparison, my Macbook is still better than my work Dell Latitude (which costs the same) that sounds like a jet engine because the fan keeps coming on, battery lasts for less than 5 hours, wireless keeps dropping, and I occasionally gets the BSOD... Nothing's perfect, that's just life.

ethbro 7y ago
Try an XPS.
- lone_haxx0r 7y ago
  Those have coil whine.
  - ebg13 7y ago
    They also fail in other ways at relatively high rates (trackpad, sound, display, ...)
  - robocat 7y ago
    For anyone looking at getting an XPS, beware that this is a consistent problem. I notice it on my 9570 (2018), and I saw a review of this year's XPS 13 9380 (2019) mention the problem. Googling shows it has been a problem since at least the XPS 9530 (2013).
    - IronBacon 7y ago
      Yup. The damning thing is, when questioned about the issue, Dell representatives have always declared that the HW is working within specs. I don't recall the exact wording, something like "noise emissions level is under some required threshold" (I don't have the link at hand but I think I can rescue at least one from Dell support forum). The thing is, to me the fan noise when it turns on is less annoying than the high pitched whine. I have an old XPS 13 model (9333 I think, the battery is still going strong tho) and with the keyboard backlight turned off (I won't use it anyway) and no USB peripherals attached is dead silent. Otherwise, If I plug a mouse or an USB hub/network adapter there is the continuous whine. To be honest, I can only hear it in silent rooms in my home with window closed, in an office environment it's droned out. The whine is the only gripe I have with the HW as Debian has worked flawlessly with it.
  - ethbro 7y ago
    Can't speak to the newer ones, but people griped about my model (9343, 2015) having it as well. Mine's quiet as a mouse. Sample size 1, maybe I was just lucky. But happy people don't tend to be as loud as angry people.
  - stringyham 7y ago
    And my XPS 13 9350 (2015) has display problems. My screen stopped working for a week and started working again for absolutely no reason. It's a known problem : https://www.dell.com/community/XPS/XPS-13-9350-Black-Screen/ https://www.dell.com/community/XPS/XPS-13-9350-Black-Screen/ And none of the mentioned fixes worked more than a day for me.
handedness 7y ago
I was the guy who read these things and thought, "these must be outliers." And yet, here I am, three keyboards later, with no end in sight given that I couldn't possibly baby mine more than I do without locking it up in an argon-filled clean room. History won't look at this era of Apple laptops favorably. It really makes one wonder how they missed this one. It's also an indictment of this era of both hardware and software that nobody else produces a more compelling option.
- asark 7y ago
  > It's also an indictment of this era of both hardware and software that nobody else produces a more compelling option. They were way ahead of other laptop makers in basically every way but upgradeability, so they could afford to screw up like 1/2 of all the things about their laptop (all at once, which is pretty crazy), badly, and still be way ahead on the other 1/2, such that switching isn't an unequivocal win.
  - gamblor956 7y ago
    I often think that Apple fans have Stockholm syndrome. They're constantly repairing their Apple products while simultaneously claiming that Apple stuff is the best-built stuff in its class. Meanwhile, I still have a Dell Latitude 10+ years old that's chugging along on its original battery (now down to about 30 min battery life), an HP consumer convertible laptop (early precursor to the tablet laptop era) that's almost as old and still chugging along. Keyboards on both still work great and have survived pizza, crumbs, and numerous spills--and both still infinitely more comfortable than the punishingly thin keyboards on their Apple counterparts of the time and since. My Surface Pro 3 has survived being dropped multiple times from heights that have killed my coworkers' iWhatevers. Oh... and the real kicker? Each of these laptops cost several hundred dollars less than comparable Apple laptops with the same or better specs. Pretty much the only category Apple had them beat was in (subjective) appearance.
    - asark 7y ago
      I switched relatively late (2011 or so) after about a decade of Windows and Linux laptops. The actually-usable trackpad that didn't make me want to carry a mouse everywhere if I actually wanted to use the computer on the go, the battery life that didn't have me looking for outlets everywhere and carting my power supply all over the place, the screen quality, and all the hardware actually working the way it was supposed to (including all sleep modes, with no fiddling and crashes- or hangs-on-wake pretty much never happening!) were all like entering a new world. "You mean I can just close the lid, unplug, and walk away, without taking other stuff and without babying the sleep process? What is this madness?"
jolmg 7y ago
My work laptop is a Panasonic CF-C2 toughbook and I love it. It makes no sound at all, ever. With its tough build and rubber strap below it, it's comfortable enough to swing around in one hand with no serious risk of accident. It also has a small internal battery in addition to its detachable one. I don't have an extra battery to really make use of it, but the point is that you can hot-swap the battery while the computer is running.

ethbro 7y ago

Try an XPS.

lone_haxx0r 7y ago
Those have coil whine.
- ebg13 7y ago
  They also fail in other ways at relatively high rates (trackpad, sound, display, ...)
- robocat 7y ago
  For anyone looking at getting an XPS, beware that this is a consistent problem. I notice it on my 9570 (2018), and I saw a review of this year's XPS 13 9380 (2019) mention the problem. Googling shows it has been a problem since at least the XPS 9530 (2013).
  - IronBacon 7y ago
    Yup. The damning thing is, when questioned about the issue, Dell representatives have always declared that the HW is working within specs. I don't recall the exact wording, something like "noise emissions level is under some required threshold" (I don't have the link at hand but I think I can rescue at least one from Dell support forum). The thing is, to me the fan noise when it turns on is less annoying than the high pitched whine. I have an old XPS 13 model (9333 I think, the battery is still going strong tho) and with the keyboard backlight turned off (I won't use it anyway) and no USB peripherals attached is dead silent. Otherwise, If I plug a mouse or an USB hub/network adapter there is the continuous whine. To be honest, I can only hear it in silent rooms in my home with window closed, in an office environment it's droned out. The whine is the only gripe I have with the HW as Debian has worked flawlessly with it.
- ethbro 7y ago
  Can't speak to the newer ones, but people griped about my model (9343, 2015) having it as well. Mine's quiet as a mouse. Sample size 1, maybe I was just lucky. But happy people don't tend to be as loud as angry people.
- stringyham 7y ago
  And my XPS 13 9350 (2015) has display problems. My screen stopped working for a week and started working again for absolutely no reason. It's a known problem : https://www.dell.com/community/XPS/XPS-13-9350-Black-Screen/ https://www.dell.com/community/XPS/XPS-13-9350-Black-Screen/ And none of the mentioned fixes worked more than a day for me.

handedness 7y ago

I was the guy who read these things and thought, "these must be outliers." And yet, here I am, three keyboards later, with no end in sight given that I couldn't possibly baby mine more than I do without locking it up in an argon-filled clean room. History won't look at this era of Apple laptops favorably. It really makes one wonder how they missed this one. It's also an indictment of this era of both hardware and software that nobody else produces a more compelling option.

asark 7y ago
> It's also an indictment of this era of both hardware and software that nobody else produces a more compelling option. They were way ahead of other laptop makers in basically every way but upgradeability, so they could afford to screw up like 1/2 of all the things about their laptop (all at once, which is pretty crazy), badly, and still be way ahead on the other 1/2, such that switching isn't an unequivocal win.
- gamblor956 7y ago
  I often think that Apple fans have Stockholm syndrome. They're constantly repairing their Apple products while simultaneously claiming that Apple stuff is the best-built stuff in its class. Meanwhile, I still have a Dell Latitude 10+ years old that's chugging along on its original battery (now down to about 30 min battery life), an HP consumer convertible laptop (early precursor to the tablet laptop era) that's almost as old and still chugging along. Keyboards on both still work great and have survived pizza, crumbs, and numerous spills--and both still infinitely more comfortable than the punishingly thin keyboards on their Apple counterparts of the time and since. My Surface Pro 3 has survived being dropped multiple times from heights that have killed my coworkers' iWhatevers. Oh... and the real kicker? Each of these laptops cost several hundred dollars less than comparable Apple laptops with the same or better specs. Pretty much the only category Apple had them beat was in (subjective) appearance.
  - asark 7y ago
    I switched relatively late (2011 or so) after about a decade of Windows and Linux laptops. The actually-usable trackpad that didn't make me want to carry a mouse everywhere if I actually wanted to use the computer on the go, the battery life that didn't have me looking for outlets everywhere and carting my power supply all over the place, the screen quality, and all the hardware actually working the way it was supposed to (including all sleep modes, with no fiddling and crashes- or hangs-on-wake pretty much never happening!) were all like entering a new world. "You mean I can just close the lid, unplug, and walk away, without taking other stuff and without babying the sleep process? What is this madness?"

jolmg 7y ago

My work laptop is a Panasonic CF-C2 toughbook and I love it. It makes no sound at all, ever. With its tough build and rubber strap below it, it's comfortable enough to swing around in one hand with no serious risk of accident. It also has a small internal battery in addition to its detachable one. I don't have an extra battery to really make use of it, but the point is that you can hot-swap the battery while the computer is running.