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While I appreciate Apple's care to make sure Macs are as secure as possible, I feel like silently disabling or interfering with applications on users' machines

While I appreciate Apple's care to make sure Macs are as secure as possible, I feel like silently disabling or interfering with applications on users' machines is almost going to far. I hate to use such a cliche term, but isn't this a slippery slope?

cj 7y ago
In my opinion, no. Any program that cannot be uninstalled (and programs that automatically reinstall themselves) should be treated as malware. Even if it’s developed by a $26 billion dollar company.
- aarbor989 7y ago
  I agree it's more akin to malware, but without knowing the implementation details of how the removal was actually done, to me it just feels like a bandaid monkeypatch. For example, it seems like the removal of the Zoom local server was hardcoded into the first silent patch. How can Apple tell between the Zoom local server and a local server I am using for development? I just get the feeling that if any other vendor was silently disrupting applications I (knowingly) installed, there would be outrage
  - jsjohnst 7y ago
    > How can Apple tell between the Zoom local server and a local server I am using for development? Really!? Please tell me that was just a flippant comment and not really a genuine question. Hint, it’s all based on the hash of the executable. ;)
- Wowfunhappy 7y ago
  What if I used this program for work? What if I had some super important business meeting worth a million bucks, and I opened my computer to discover Zoom et al was suddenly missing? If I'd decided to run an update right before my super important meeting, that would have been my own fault. But if Apple did it silently...
  - pixl97 7y ago
    >What if I had some super important business meeting worth a million bucks, Well, running insecure versions of zoom, you can rest assured that your competitors will have that meeting too. And you can add about a billion other what ifs. What if the internet is down. What if the zoom cloud is down. Always have a backup program if that much money is on the line and hope they all dont stick it on AWS.
  - aareet 7y ago
    I understand what you're getting at, but in this particular case, Zoom is capable of joining a call in-browser (like Google Hangouts) which doesn't require the server that was affected by the silent update. So you'd still be able to join that call, just not using the native app. Perhaps that was part of their risk analysis when they decided to ship the update.

cj 7y ago

In my opinion, no. Any program that cannot be uninstalled (and programs that automatically reinstall themselves) should be treated as malware. Even if it’s developed by a $26 billion dollar company.

aarbor989 7y ago
I agree it's more akin to malware, but without knowing the implementation details of how the removal was actually done, to me it just feels like a bandaid monkeypatch. For example, it seems like the removal of the Zoom local server was hardcoded into the first silent patch. How can Apple tell between the Zoom local server and a local server I am using for development? I just get the feeling that if any other vendor was silently disrupting applications I (knowingly) installed, there would be outrage
- jsjohnst 7y ago
  > How can Apple tell between the Zoom local server and a local server I am using for development? Really!? Please tell me that was just a flippant comment and not really a genuine question. Hint, it’s all based on the hash of the executable. ;)
Wowfunhappy 7y ago
What if I used this program for work? What if I had some super important business meeting worth a million bucks, and I opened my computer to discover Zoom et al was suddenly missing? If I'd decided to run an update right before my super important meeting, that would have been my own fault. But if Apple did it silently...
- pixl97 7y ago
  >What if I had some super important business meeting worth a million bucks, Well, running insecure versions of zoom, you can rest assured that your competitors will have that meeting too. And you can add about a billion other what ifs. What if the internet is down. What if the zoom cloud is down. Always have a backup program if that much money is on the line and hope they all dont stick it on AWS.
- aareet 7y ago
  I understand what you're getting at, but in this particular case, Zoom is capable of joining a call in-browser (like Google Hangouts) which doesn't require the server that was affected by the silent update. So you'd still be able to join that call, just not using the native app. Perhaps that was part of their risk analysis when they decided to ship the update.