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> There are approximately three first-world Western cities that have any business having faregates on their urban rail networks: London, Paris, New York. Even t
by dahdum 7y ago
> There are approximately three first-world Western cities that have any business having faregates on their urban rail networks: London, Paris, New York. Even there, I am skeptical that the faregates are truly necessary.
Not sure I agree with this, Tokyo has well designed faregates and with contactless it's really fast. Since fare evasion is usually a minor crime and/or comes with steep penalties, I'd rather structurally reduce it instead of making it easier and punishing after the fact.
- diffset 7y agoSeriously, I take BART daily and it would benefit greatly from the biggest gates they can find. So many of BART's problems are caused by fare evasion.
- simonebrunozzi 7y agoYou are not wrong; and yet, HOW they use their money is another big problem altogether. I can't find the right reference now, but BART is one of the most expensive transit systems in the world ("per mile", I assume the calculation was) in terms of maintenance and operations.
- Animats 7y agoTaller fare gates are in test at Richmond BART station right now.[1][2] The regular lane works OK, but the fat people/wheelchair lane has problems. NYC just puts in very strong stainless steel turnstile cages 8 feet high.[3] [1] https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/BART-s-new-stacked-gates-meant-to-deter-14083809.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/BART-s-new-stack... [2] https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/BART-Fare-Evaders-Caught-on-Video-Scuffling-With-Police-512558982.html https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/BART-Fare-Evaders-Caug... [3] https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/cagelike-subway-turnstiles-bambooze-experienced-straphangers-paying-fare-article-1.474935 https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/cagelike-subway-turnsti...
- betterunix2 7y agoNYC has some of the most annoying faregates ever conceived of. The "cages" have bizarre mechanics that makes pushing them annoying, and the "normal" turnstiles make it hard to push even a small suitcase through. Tokyo has probably the best-designed faregates I have ever seen and I wish NYC would copy them.
- Animats 7y agoNYC has some of the most annoying faregates ever conceived of. The "cages" That's so New York, to have an in-your-face un-jumpable turnstile.
- beowulfey 7y agoSpecifically referring to Western cities... Author does use Tokyo as an example of excellent fare control when needed due to usage later in the article, so they do agree with you there.
- dahdum 7y agoIf the author believes no Western city needs faregates at all, shouldn't it follow that the vast majority of them in Tokyo are unnecessary too?
- papln 7y agoYes, as the article clearly states: "Only the overcrowded lines in Tokyo (and a handful in Osaka, Beijing, and Shanghai) are clearly so busy that barrier-free proof-of-payment fare enforcement is infeasible."
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- the_mitsuhiko 7y agoFaregates are awful for people in wheelchairs and family with strollers. Vienna does not have faregates and the fare evasion is low. Additionally it’s cheaper to operate because it requires fewer staff and machines (statement by the operators).
- bifrost 7y agoYes, because the culture there is very different. A lot of systems that work in Europe just can't be transplanted to the US without a massive shift in the culture.