5 ms·

Google's claim that the algorithm is generic is demonstrably false. Type in "hillary clinton e" and there is no suggestion for "email", type "donald trump e" an

by ar-jan 7y ago

Google's claim that the algorithm is generic is demonstrably false. Type in "hillary clinton e" and there is no suggestion for "email", type "donald trump e" and email is the first suggestion. Given the news content that we know is out there, that can only be the result of adjusting the results for clinton specifically (if anything, we would not expect "email" to be autocompleted for trump). This is not research that tells us what exactly Google is doing, but you cannot deny the example.

ghostpepper 7y ago
This is not the most scientific test, since previous searches are generally taken into account. Was this test conducted from a system that mostly searches for / clicks on pro-trump or anti-trump content?
- ar-jan 7y ago
  Well, that's kind of the point: it's not scientific, but it's relevant. I believe this was also the example that was recently used in a Project Veritas video, with the same results. I searched from a Firefox private window over a VPN from the Netherlands. But since the results are the same (regarding presence/absence of "email" as an autocomplete term) I don't think it matters much.
root_axis 7y ago
This is not "research" period. Using one arbitrary search comparison to draw conclusions about the nature of a system that processes billions of queries a day is pretty weak. Additionally, I don't get the same results you do. "hillary clinton e" does not bring up emails, nor does "donald trump e" bring up emails (the first results I see are election, education, england visit, ex wife). I'm not ruling out the possibility that google actually is manipulating search results, but this is not proof of that.
- bodono 7y ago
  Try "hillary clinton emai". From a fresh chrome session in NYC I get nothing, not a single autocomplete result. On the other hand "donald trump emai" gets: * donald trump email * donald trump email address * donald trump email list * donald trump email newsletter * donald trump email list signup And just to drive the point home I tried "root_axis emai" and got "root_axis email". Try anyone else and you get similar results, 'barack obama emai', 'george bush emai', etc etc. So yes, this is proof that the results are scrubbed for Clinton email.
  - mrep 7y ago
    Seems to go both ways though as I'm not getting any auto completion results for "donald trump stormy daniels" either. I'm guessing they scrub things that are highly sensationalized in the news.
    - bodono 7y ago
      "stormy daniels" doesn't get any autocomplete results for me even without trump, my guess is this is more about adult search terms getting blacklisted rather than political. For example "donald trump e j" gets "donald trump e jean carroll", E Jean Carroll recently accused Trump of a serious sexual assault and this is autocompleting.
  - scott_s 7y ago
    I got curious and tried the names of a bunch of public figures. Some of "<first and last name> e" yielded "email" as the suggestion. But these did not: elizabeth holmes, tom jones, tom cruise, brad pitt, gwyneth paltrow, roger federer, will smith, jimmy carter. Since Hillary Clinton is not unique, then it's not proof that her results are treated differently.
    - bodono 7y ago
      They all work fine for me, e.g., 'tom jones emai' -> 'tom jones email', only Clinton didn't.
    - malvosenior 7y ago
- Excel_Wizard 7y ago
  "hillary clinton emails" is a topic that is widely published around the web. Autocomplete should pick up on this and recommend it. I even went to the trouble of typing "hillary clinton emai" and no autocomplete suggestions were brought up. It is a rather suspicious result. Suspicious enough that it is hard not to imagine a deliberate act is behind it. I admit that I don't have any proof.
- ar-jan 7y ago
  That's the point: this is not research, but whatever is going on at Google, the explanation has to account for examples like these. It's simply one observation that you cannot discount. I just tried searching again a few times with new private windows, and "email" alternates between first and fourth suggestion for trump. But the more important point is the absence of the suggestion for clinton: we know it's been in the news extensively, we know people searched for this phrase a lot, and now "email" has been removed from the suggestions only for Clinton. I tried searching a few more U.S. politicians, and for all of them "e" autosuggests "email" somewhere between first and fourth place. So the complete absence for Clinton does not look like a generic algorithm change.
  - root_axis 7y ago
    When I type "Donald Trump R" I don't see any autocomplete for "Donald Trump Russia" despite plenty of news coverage on this topic. So what? This isn't proof of anything. I can indeed discount "one observation" because it is literally a single search query used to draw a conclusion about an insanely complex system that processes billions of queries a day. I am open to the possibility that google is manipulating search results, but to demonstrate this you need to account for many other possible search queries that produce seemingly unexpected results. Dissecting one politically charged query and claiming it is proof of google's malfeasance doesn't make sense. Anyone can string together a couple strange query results to support their own subjective narrative about what should appear and the supposed sinister machinations behind the query results.
  - bduerst 7y ago
    Right, and further observations show that it's not unique to Hillary Clinton. This means you can discount the claim since it uses cherry picked data.
    - exolymph 7y ago
      But we still haven't answered the actual question: Why doesn't "email" come up in autocomplete for Hillary Clinton, when it clearly should?
nova22033 7y ago
How is autocomplete a sign of bias...Take an average voter...not very plugged in..he types in "hillary clinton e" and gets no autocomplete suggestions...he thinks Hillary Clinton didn't do anything wrong with her e-mail server? Do you seriously believe this? Curious....Did you get any results for "hillary clinton e-mails"?

by ar-jan 7y ago

ghostpepper 7y ago

This is not the most scientific test, since previous searches are generally taken into account. Was this test conducted from a system that mostly searches for / clicks on pro-trump or anti-trump content?

ar-jan 7y ago
Well, that's kind of the point: it's not scientific, but it's relevant. I believe this was also the example that was recently used in a Project Veritas video, with the same results. I searched from a Firefox private window over a VPN from the Netherlands. But since the results are the same (regarding presence/absence of "email" as an autocomplete term) I don't think it matters much.

root_axis 7y ago

This is not "research" period. Using one arbitrary search comparison to draw conclusions about the nature of a system that processes billions of queries a day is pretty weak. Additionally, I don't get the same results you do. "hillary clinton e" does not bring up emails, nor does "donald trump e" bring up emails (the first results I see are election, education, england visit, ex wife). I'm not ruling out the possibility that google actually is manipulating search results, but this is not proof of that.

bodono 7y ago
Try "hillary clinton emai". From a fresh chrome session in NYC I get nothing, not a single autocomplete result. On the other hand "donald trump emai" gets: * donald trump email * donald trump email address * donald trump email list * donald trump email newsletter * donald trump email list signup And just to drive the point home I tried "root_axis emai" and got "root_axis email". Try anyone else and you get similar results, 'barack obama emai', 'george bush emai', etc etc. So yes, this is proof that the results are scrubbed for Clinton email.
- mrep 7y ago
  Seems to go both ways though as I'm not getting any auto completion results for "donald trump stormy daniels" either. I'm guessing they scrub things that are highly sensationalized in the news.
  - bodono 7y ago
    "stormy daniels" doesn't get any autocomplete results for me even without trump, my guess is this is more about adult search terms getting blacklisted rather than political. For example "donald trump e j" gets "donald trump e jean carroll", E Jean Carroll recently accused Trump of a serious sexual assault and this is autocompleting.
- scott_s 7y ago
  I got curious and tried the names of a bunch of public figures. Some of "<first and last name> e" yielded "email" as the suggestion. But these did not: elizabeth holmes, tom jones, tom cruise, brad pitt, gwyneth paltrow, roger federer, will smith, jimmy carter. Since Hillary Clinton is not unique, then it's not proof that her results are treated differently.
  - bodono 7y ago
    They all work fine for me, e.g., 'tom jones emai' -> 'tom jones email', only Clinton didn't.
  - malvosenior 7y ago
Excel_Wizard 7y ago
"hillary clinton emails" is a topic that is widely published around the web. Autocomplete should pick up on this and recommend it. I even went to the trouble of typing "hillary clinton emai" and no autocomplete suggestions were brought up. It is a rather suspicious result. Suspicious enough that it is hard not to imagine a deliberate act is behind it. I admit that I don't have any proof.
ar-jan 7y ago
That's the point: this is not research, but whatever is going on at Google, the explanation has to account for examples like these. It's simply one observation that you cannot discount. I just tried searching again a few times with new private windows, and "email" alternates between first and fourth suggestion for trump. But the more important point is the absence of the suggestion for clinton: we know it's been in the news extensively, we know people searched for this phrase a lot, and now "email" has been removed from the suggestions only for Clinton. I tried searching a few more U.S. politicians, and for all of them "e" autosuggests "email" somewhere between first and fourth place. So the complete absence for Clinton does not look like a generic algorithm change.
- root_axis 7y ago
  When I type "Donald Trump R" I don't see any autocomplete for "Donald Trump Russia" despite plenty of news coverage on this topic. So what? This isn't proof of anything. I can indeed discount "one observation" because it is literally a single search query used to draw a conclusion about an insanely complex system that processes billions of queries a day. I am open to the possibility that google is manipulating search results, but to demonstrate this you need to account for many other possible search queries that produce seemingly unexpected results. Dissecting one politically charged query and claiming it is proof of google's malfeasance doesn't make sense. Anyone can string together a couple strange query results to support their own subjective narrative about what should appear and the supposed sinister machinations behind the query results.
- bduerst 7y ago
  Right, and further observations show that it's not unique to Hillary Clinton. This means you can discount the claim since it uses cherry picked data.
  - exolymph 7y ago
    But we still haven't answered the actual question: Why doesn't "email" come up in autocomplete for Hillary Clinton, when it clearly should?

nova22033 7y ago

How is autocomplete a sign of bias...Take an average voter...not very plugged in..he types in "hillary clinton e" and gets no autocomplete suggestions...he thinks Hillary Clinton didn't do anything wrong with her e-mail server? Do you seriously believe this? Curious....Did you get any results for "hillary clinton e-mails"?