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Trust me, the difference between the comments vertically scrolling in the sidebar and horizontally on top of the video is huge. In Twitch, when the comments bec

Trust me, the difference between the comments vertically scrolling in the sidebar and horizontally on top of the video is huge. In Twitch, when the comments become fast enough they literally give no time for the viewer to parse and understand most of them; With bullet comments plus Asian languages that have high letter-to-meaning ratio (or at least with my experience with Japanese on Niconico), each of the comments horizontally scrolling on top of the video leave just enough mental processing time to read through the majority of them and to grasp the atmosphere of the commenting hive-mind more clearly. This creates a sense of togetherness that is much more tight-knit than what you get from Twitch comments.

taneq 7y ago
So the increased density of languages like Japanese actually translates to faster reading comprehension? I guess I'd always assumed that concepts-per-second would be about the same even if one language took up more physical space per concept than another.
- needle0 7y ago
  I've seen some videos on Niconico with English comments but those were a lot harder to read. Perhaps concepts-per-second between EN/JP are similar if reading a static page, but English text tends to use more characters than JP text that express the same idea, making the system scroll it faster and thus harder to read as they whiz by. Maybe it's a Niconico issue and the system is tuned to reward comments in the typical JP length to be the most readable; I'm not sure.
lifthrasiir 7y ago
One complicated reason why horizontally scrolling comments are not more widespread is a patent. Dwango has two related patents (Japanese patents no. 4695583 & 4734471), so competitors had to work around them; most prominently, FC2's Himawari Douga was able to escape the trap by moving an input form inside the video (something Dwango was unable to secure due to prior arts) [1]. But this was hard win, and probably it is much safer to avoid horizontally scrolling comments at all. I'm aware of several Korean and Japanese video websites that have rejected this system exactly due to patent concerns. Interestingly though, Bilibili and many other Chinese video websites do use the very same comment system as Niconico! More amusingly it is legal because Dwango's patents are dated on December 2006 and that was before the Chinese Patent Law has amended on 2008 to much broadly acknowledge foreign patents [2]. As a result they are free to use the system without a patent issue [3], and it is probably partly why they got popular in China. [1] https://news.yahoo.co.jp/byline/kuriharakiyoshi/20180926-00098303/ https://news.yahoo.co.jp/byline/kuriharakiyoshi/20180926-000... [2] https://www.ipo.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/DragonGetsNewIPClaws.pdf https://www.ipo.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/DragonGetsNew... [3] http://www.acgn-globalbiz.com/entry/2019/01/06/%E5%8B%95%E7%94%BB%E9%85%8D%E4%BF%A1%E3%82%B5%E3%83%BC%E3%83%93%E3%82%B9%E3%81%AB%E3%81%8A%E3%81%91%E3%82%8B%E3%82%B3%E3%83%A1%E3%83%B3%E3%83%88%E9%85%8D%E4%BF%A1%EF%BC%9D%E5%BC%BE%E5%B9%95%E6%8A%80 http://www.acgn-globalbiz.com/entry/2019/01/06/%E5%8B%95%E7%...
- mac01021 7y ago
  How could anyone decide that horizontally scrolling text is an idea substantial and original enough to be worthy of a patent?
  - taneq 7y ago
    You forget that "click the mouse once" was considered patentable.
runj__ 7y ago
> Asian languages that have high letter-to-meaning ratio [...], each of the comments horizontally scrolling on top of the video leave just enough mental processing time to read through the majority of them This is what emotes are for, no? Most of the comments in a traditional Forsen stream are emotes and I'd argue that they give you a pretty good idea of the atmosphere of the chat.

taneq 7y ago

So the increased density of languages like Japanese actually translates to faster reading comprehension? I guess I'd always assumed that concepts-per-second would be about the same even if one language took up more physical space per concept than another.

needle0 7y ago
I've seen some videos on Niconico with English comments but those were a lot harder to read. Perhaps concepts-per-second between EN/JP are similar if reading a static page, but English text tends to use more characters than JP text that express the same idea, making the system scroll it faster and thus harder to read as they whiz by. Maybe it's a Niconico issue and the system is tuned to reward comments in the typical JP length to be the most readable; I'm not sure.

lifthrasiir 7y ago

One complicated reason why horizontally scrolling comments are not more widespread is a patent. Dwango has two related patents (Japanese patents no. 4695583 & 4734471), so competitors had to work around them; most prominently, FC2's Himawari Douga was able to escape the trap by moving an input form inside the video (something Dwango was unable to secure due to prior arts) [1]. But this was hard win, and probably it is much safer to avoid horizontally scrolling comments at all. I'm aware of several Korean and Japanese video websites that have rejected this system exactly due to patent concerns. Interestingly though, Bilibili and many other Chinese video websites do use the very same comment system as Niconico! More amusingly it is legal because Dwango's patents are dated on December 2006 and that was before the Chinese Patent Law has amended on 2008 to much broadly acknowledge foreign patents [2]. As a result they are free to use the system without a patent issue [3], and it is probably partly why they got popular in China. [1] https://news.yahoo.co.jp/byline/kuriharakiyoshi/20180926-00098303/ https://news.yahoo.co.jp/byline/kuriharakiyoshi/20180926-000... [2] https://www.ipo.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/DragonGetsNewIPClaws.pdf https://www.ipo.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/DragonGetsNew... [3] http://www.acgn-globalbiz.com/entry/2019/01/06/%E5%8B%95%E7%94%BB%E9%85%8D%E4%BF%A1%E3%82%B5%E3%83%BC%E3%83%93%E3%82%B9%E3%81%AB%E3%81%8A%E3%81%91%E3%82%8B%E3%82%B3%E3%83%A1%E3%83%B3%E3%83%88%E9%85%8D%E4%BF%A1%EF%BC%9D%E5%BC%BE%E5%B9%95%E6%8A%80 http://www.acgn-globalbiz.com/entry/2019/01/06/%E5%8B%95%E7%...

mac01021 7y ago
How could anyone decide that horizontally scrolling text is an idea substantial and original enough to be worthy of a patent?
- taneq 7y ago
  You forget that "click the mouse once" was considered patentable.

runj__ 7y ago

> Asian languages that have high letter-to-meaning ratio [...], each of the comments horizontally scrolling on top of the video leave just enough mental processing time to read through the majority of them This is what emotes are for, no? Most of the comments in a traditional Forsen stream are emotes and I'd argue that they give you a pretty good idea of the atmosphere of the chat.