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The groups 'homeless due to housing affordability' and 'homeless due to mental health or drug problems' As housing prices rise, there are people with mental he

The groups 'homeless due to housing affordability' and 'homeless due to mental health or drug problems' As housing prices rise, there are people with mental health or drug issues who are largely stable who lose their housing and then become unstable. There are government organizations and nonprofits that can now provide less units of housing to the same people because their money doesn't go as far. There are people who are just at the edge of stability and whom their local community is stabalizing and for whom moving to new affordable housing destabilizes. There are halfway houses that seeing too many needful people turn out problematic people they might've otherwise tolerated because they can bring in less problematic people who equally need help.

dodobirdlord 7y ago
Sure, some number of such people surely exist, but do we have a particular reason to believe that it's actually a significant number? On these sorts of major issues of policy a couple hundred people here and there are a rounding error. There's no end of controversy about the various methods of counting what percent of homeless people in high cost of living areas are "non-native"; everyone running such studies has an agenda, but the impression I've gotten is that there is consensus that it's upwards of 50%. It seems implausible that a significant number of people have been driven from a stable life to mental illness wracked visible homelessness by the skyrocketing cost of housing in a small number of major cities.
- DoreenMichele 7y ago
  I don't find it implausible. Living in a broken society is crazy making. Doing everything you think and get told you "should" do to succeed and life coming apart at the seams anyway is crazy making. Poor nutrition because you have can't make ends meet after paying your ridiculous student loans that were supposed to propel you to a better life takes its toll. Etc ad nauseum. We've created a society that chews people up and spits them out. Then we act like it's a personal problem when they crack under the pressure.
  - jelliclesfarm 7y ago
    I hear you but as an immigrant, I can’t relate. Maybe immigrants are grittier and scrappy, but when the going gets tough, we get out of Dodge and go anywhere else where we can not just survive but thrive. Oh my goodness! America is huge and you don’t need to apply for a visa to go to another state. And you are free to move around anywhere and enjoy certain fundamental benefits that is available to all. When I first came to this country 22 years ago, I first lost my shit and then my mind when I found out that libraries are free! And anyone can checkout handfuls of books. I remember paying a monthly fee for a library card in India and can get only two books at a time. Standing in line outside American embassy and British council after school because you can’t fins Time magazine or Nat Geo elsewhere because they were expensive publication. Non vernaculars were not widely available. The Russian consulate had second Saturday chess matches and my mother would take me by bus and if I had a good play, I would get treated with ice cream. I rented a computer for a month when I found out what TCP/IP was and then had to get a phone connection for which the deposit was as much as our monthly rent. I would hazard a guess that most immigrants would call the above problems mentioned as an uniquely first world complaint. Poverty, lack of opportunities..poor nutrition? It’s all crazy sounding to most of us. I remember when I studied for my college exams under candle light because the power grid in my Indian city was unreliable. And it’s not like I am quoting a Monty Python skit. I won’t even get started about nutrition. It would literally sound like a MP skit. Student loans? My mother went into personal debt to put me through school and college. And she was a single mother. I can’t wrap my mind around what I see here in America. It is entirely unrelatable. It’s like..the country is a gazelle that has never been taught survival skills to be alive in the wild. And then...boom!!.. life happens. I hear you but I want to let you know that for majority of people in the world, this would sound utterly bizarre and they’d gladly swap places with you. No disrespect. Just a different perspective.
    - DoreenMichele 7y ago
      My mother is an immigrant and this has helped me sidestep a lot of the pitfalls that are currently a significant burden for far too many Americans. The fact that some people can manage to make things work for them here in no way changes the fact that the system has substantial issues that are in urgent need of remedy.
- DubiousPusher 7y ago
  >Sure, some number of such people surely exist, but do we have a particular reason to believe that it's actually a significant number I would say, because places with affordable housing have far less homelessness. And while correlation is not causation the correlation is very compelling right now. I can't say how many homeless people are mentally ill but stable people who lost their housing but I will say this. Every mentally ill person that experiences bouts of psychosis and whom doesn't have a strong support network is one missed dose, one lost job, one episode away from homelessness.
  - cavisne 7y ago
    Places with affordable housing is a synonym for rural areas without government services (or drug dealers). The best place to be homeless is Seattle or SF because drug use and dealing is legal (or at least not enforced), and there are plenty of shelters/other support services. Thats why Portland puts homeless people on buses to Seattle. Based on the polling it seems likely the rule of law will be reestablished in Seattle after the next council election, so it will be an interesting way to see if affordable housing was the true cause of the issue.
    - DubiousPusher 7y ago
      It may not. Just because these people disappear does not mean we fixed the cause. It may simply be that they are housed out of sight in jail or prison. Also there are many cities that don't have housing affordability crises so no I'm not talking exclusively about rural areas.
    - panopticon 7y ago
      > Places with affordable housing is a synonym for rural areas without government services (or drug dealers). I may be misreading this, but it sounds like you're saying rural areas don't have drug dealers? If so, that's patently false. Rural substance abuse rates are generally within 5% of urban abuse rates. They certainly aren't picking up that meth from the local grocery story.

dodobirdlord 7y ago

Sure, some number of such people surely exist, but do we have a particular reason to believe that it's actually a significant number? On these sorts of major issues of policy a couple hundred people here and there are a rounding error. There's no end of controversy about the various methods of counting what percent of homeless people in high cost of living areas are "non-native"; everyone running such studies has an agenda, but the impression I've gotten is that there is consensus that it's upwards of 50%. It seems implausible that a significant number of people have been driven from a stable life to mental illness wracked visible homelessness by the skyrocketing cost of housing in a small number of major cities.

DoreenMichele 7y ago
I don't find it implausible. Living in a broken society is crazy making. Doing everything you think and get told you "should" do to succeed and life coming apart at the seams anyway is crazy making. Poor nutrition because you have can't make ends meet after paying your ridiculous student loans that were supposed to propel you to a better life takes its toll. Etc ad nauseum. We've created a society that chews people up and spits them out. Then we act like it's a personal problem when they crack under the pressure.
- jelliclesfarm 7y ago
  I hear you but as an immigrant, I can’t relate. Maybe immigrants are grittier and scrappy, but when the going gets tough, we get out of Dodge and go anywhere else where we can not just survive but thrive. Oh my goodness! America is huge and you don’t need to apply for a visa to go to another state. And you are free to move around anywhere and enjoy certain fundamental benefits that is available to all. When I first came to this country 22 years ago, I first lost my shit and then my mind when I found out that libraries are free! And anyone can checkout handfuls of books. I remember paying a monthly fee for a library card in India and can get only two books at a time. Standing in line outside American embassy and British council after school because you can’t fins Time magazine or Nat Geo elsewhere because they were expensive publication. Non vernaculars were not widely available. The Russian consulate had second Saturday chess matches and my mother would take me by bus and if I had a good play, I would get treated with ice cream. I rented a computer for a month when I found out what TCP/IP was and then had to get a phone connection for which the deposit was as much as our monthly rent. I would hazard a guess that most immigrants would call the above problems mentioned as an uniquely first world complaint. Poverty, lack of opportunities..poor nutrition? It’s all crazy sounding to most of us. I remember when I studied for my college exams under candle light because the power grid in my Indian city was unreliable. And it’s not like I am quoting a Monty Python skit. I won’t even get started about nutrition. It would literally sound like a MP skit. Student loans? My mother went into personal debt to put me through school and college. And she was a single mother. I can’t wrap my mind around what I see here in America. It is entirely unrelatable. It’s like..the country is a gazelle that has never been taught survival skills to be alive in the wild. And then...boom!!.. life happens. I hear you but I want to let you know that for majority of people in the world, this would sound utterly bizarre and they’d gladly swap places with you. No disrespect. Just a different perspective.
  - DoreenMichele 7y ago
    My mother is an immigrant and this has helped me sidestep a lot of the pitfalls that are currently a significant burden for far too many Americans. The fact that some people can manage to make things work for them here in no way changes the fact that the system has substantial issues that are in urgent need of remedy.
DubiousPusher 7y ago
>Sure, some number of such people surely exist, but do we have a particular reason to believe that it's actually a significant number I would say, because places with affordable housing have far less homelessness. And while correlation is not causation the correlation is very compelling right now. I can't say how many homeless people are mentally ill but stable people who lost their housing but I will say this. Every mentally ill person that experiences bouts of psychosis and whom doesn't have a strong support network is one missed dose, one lost job, one episode away from homelessness.
- cavisne 7y ago
  Places with affordable housing is a synonym for rural areas without government services (or drug dealers). The best place to be homeless is Seattle or SF because drug use and dealing is legal (or at least not enforced), and there are plenty of shelters/other support services. Thats why Portland puts homeless people on buses to Seattle. Based on the polling it seems likely the rule of law will be reestablished in Seattle after the next council election, so it will be an interesting way to see if affordable housing was the true cause of the issue.
  - DubiousPusher 7y ago
    It may not. Just because these people disappear does not mean we fixed the cause. It may simply be that they are housed out of sight in jail or prison. Also there are many cities that don't have housing affordability crises so no I'm not talking exclusively about rural areas.
  - panopticon 7y ago
    > Places with affordable housing is a synonym for rural areas without government services (or drug dealers). I may be misreading this, but it sounds like you're saying rural areas don't have drug dealers? If so, that's patently false. Rural substance abuse rates are generally within 5% of urban abuse rates. They certainly aren't picking up that meth from the local grocery story.