8 ms·

New York City just finished replacing the Kosciuszko Bridge, a critical segment of the BQE (I278). Most people in New York say "the koss-key-oss-ko bridge", th

by evanb 7y ago

New York City just finished replacing the Kosciuszko Bridge, a critical segment of the BQE (I278). Most people in New York say "the koss-key-oss-ko bridge", though my understanding is that the pronunciation is more like "Ko-shuz-kuh"? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosciuszko_Bridge https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosciuszko_Bridge

M4v3R 7y ago
Neither :). It’s a pretty hard word for people outside Poland. I would say it’s pronounced more like “Kosh-choosh-kuh”. It still won’t be perfect, but close enough.
- foobarian 7y ago
  These kind of shenanigans are exactly why Mr. Karadžić [1] pushed for an orthographic alphabet in Serbia, and why it quickly got adopted by neighbors as well. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vuk_Karad%C5%BEi%C4%87 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vuk_Karad%C5%BEi%C4%87
  - sverige 7y ago
    The Cyrillic alphabet is even simpler and clearer, but apparently too orthodox for Catholics.
    - foobarian 7y ago
      I blame it on Methodius. He tried to get the Catholics to use the Glagolitic but in the end it didn't take and the vacuum got filled with Latin.
      - bogomipz 7y ago
        Wasn't it one of Methodius' students that created Cyrillic though? When and why was there a void? Maybe I am misunderstanding you comment though?
    - jwieczorek 7y ago
      Indeed, it's one of the peculiarities of the Polish language that it has Slavic phonetics but a Latin alphabet. Hence why typically Slavic phonemes, which in Cyrillic are represented by single letters (such as sh = ш), in Polish get represented with two (sz), and why you need a double-letter context to know how to pronounce a given sequence of characters. Unfortunately, back in the 10th century, the choice of an alphabet was essentially a pure consequence of whom the first ruler of Poland would adopt Christianity from: the Western part of the Church (this was before the official Schism) or the Rus (Ruthenia). The Rus had a liturgy in Old Church Slavonic, and for the liturgical books they adopted an alphabet, the Glagolitic (a predecessor to the Cyrillic), which was more suitable for the phonetics of the language (and, indeed, of Slavic languages in general). Poland adopted the Latin liturgy and the alphabet was part of the “package”.
H8crilA 7y ago
These days we can ask fancy NNs to do the pronunciation: https://translate.google.com/#view=home&op=translate&sl=auto&tl=pl&text=Tadeusz%20Ko%C5%9Bciuszko https://translate.google.com/#view=home&op=translate&sl=auto...
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
r34 7y ago
Quite similar to original polish is "Koshciushco" as pronounced by GT.
daemin 7y ago
Similar to the tallest mountain in Australia, named after the same person and in general people pronounce it Ko-zee-os-ko. My father was particularly proud to correct people's pronunciation of it and to try and get them to say it the proper Polish way.
mlthoughts2018 7y ago
New Yorkers pronounce it “kozz-e-us-ko” or “kozz-e-oos-ko” not with a hard c towards the beginning.
- evanb 7y ago
  There may be New Yorkers who say it that way, but not this New Yorker, his family, or the traffic report he listens to.
- bogomipz 7y ago
  If you listen to NYC traffic reports on AM radio(1010 WINS)where this bridge is mentioned almost daily its pronounced "Koz Cuse Ko." I have never heard anybody use the pronunciation you are referring to.
  - mlthoughts2018 7y ago
    Growing up near Middle Village, I only heard “koz-e-oos-ko” or “koz-e-us-ko”. Have lived in Brooklyn & Manhattan ever since, and the same there. Definitely don’t listen to the radio. Can you find any clips where they say it this way on NY1... literally have never heard it that way.
Althorion 7y ago
Unfortunatelly, neither. Main problem with his surname is the ‘ś’ (proper spelling is ‘Kościuszko’), which doesn’t appear in English at all. The closest equivalent I can think of is Japanese sound at the beginning of words such as ‘shinobi’, which I guess English-speaking people still pronounce like ‘sh’ in ‘fish’… And then there’s ‘ci’, which is pronounced similar to ‘s’… The closest I can get is ‘Koshch-oosh-kuh’, but that’s still not it (that would be spelled ‘Koszczuszko’).
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
rootbear 7y ago
There is a small town in Mississippi named Kosciusko, and they pronounce it kosi-'uhskoh, or, in IPA, /ˌkɒsiˈʌskoʊ/. It's not far from my mother's home town and it is the home town of James Meredith and Oprah Winfrey.
perl4ever 7y ago
That's not the Kosciuszko Bridge in NY, this is the Kosciuszko Bridge in NY: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thaddeus_Kosciusko_Bridge https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thaddeus_Kosciusko_Bridge Also, I pronounce it "Ko-shooz-ko".
BrandoElFollito 7y ago
We had the same problem in France with Ms Nathalie Kosciuszko-Morizet (she was a minister). Everybody was calling her NKM.

by evanb 7y ago

M4v3R 7y ago

Neither :). It’s a pretty hard word for people outside Poland. I would say it’s pronounced more like “Kosh-choosh-kuh”. It still won’t be perfect, but close enough.

foobarian 7y ago
These kind of shenanigans are exactly why Mr. Karadžić [1] pushed for an orthographic alphabet in Serbia, and why it quickly got adopted by neighbors as well. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vuk_Karad%C5%BEi%C4%87 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vuk_Karad%C5%BEi%C4%87
- sverige 7y ago
  The Cyrillic alphabet is even simpler and clearer, but apparently too orthodox for Catholics.
  - foobarian 7y ago
    I blame it on Methodius. He tried to get the Catholics to use the Glagolitic but in the end it didn't take and the vacuum got filled with Latin.
    - bogomipz 7y ago
      Wasn't it one of Methodius' students that created Cyrillic though? When and why was there a void? Maybe I am misunderstanding you comment though?
  - jwieczorek 7y ago
    Indeed, it's one of the peculiarities of the Polish language that it has Slavic phonetics but a Latin alphabet. Hence why typically Slavic phonemes, which in Cyrillic are represented by single letters (such as sh = ш), in Polish get represented with two (sz), and why you need a double-letter context to know how to pronounce a given sequence of characters. Unfortunately, back in the 10th century, the choice of an alphabet was essentially a pure consequence of whom the first ruler of Poland would adopt Christianity from: the Western part of the Church (this was before the official Schism) or the Rus (Ruthenia). The Rus had a liturgy in Old Church Slavonic, and for the liturgical books they adopted an alphabet, the Glagolitic (a predecessor to the Cyrillic), which was more suitable for the phonetics of the language (and, indeed, of Slavic languages in general). Poland adopted the Latin liturgy and the alphabet was part of the “package”.

H8crilA 7y ago

These days we can ask fancy NNs to do the pronunciation: https://translate.google.com/#view=home&op=translate&sl=auto&tl=pl&text=Tadeusz%20Ko%C5%9Bciuszko https://translate.google.com/#view=home&op=translate&sl=auto...

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

r34 7y ago

Quite similar to original polish is "Koshciushco" as pronounced by GT.

daemin 7y ago

Similar to the tallest mountain in Australia, named after the same person and in general people pronounce it Ko-zee-os-ko. My father was particularly proud to correct people's pronunciation of it and to try and get them to say it the proper Polish way.

mlthoughts2018 7y ago

New Yorkers pronounce it “kozz-e-us-ko” or “kozz-e-oos-ko” not with a hard c towards the beginning.

evanb 7y ago
There may be New Yorkers who say it that way, but not this New Yorker, his family, or the traffic report he listens to.
bogomipz 7y ago
If you listen to NYC traffic reports on AM radio(1010 WINS)where this bridge is mentioned almost daily its pronounced "Koz Cuse Ko." I have never heard anybody use the pronunciation you are referring to.
- mlthoughts2018 7y ago
  Growing up near Middle Village, I only heard “koz-e-oos-ko” or “koz-e-us-ko”. Have lived in Brooklyn & Manhattan ever since, and the same there. Definitely don’t listen to the radio. Can you find any clips where they say it this way on NY1... literally have never heard it that way.

Althorion 7y ago

Unfortunatelly, neither. Main problem with his surname is the ‘ś’ (proper spelling is ‘Kościuszko’), which doesn’t appear in English at all. The closest equivalent I can think of is Japanese sound at the beginning of words such as ‘shinobi’, which I guess English-speaking people still pronounce like ‘sh’ in ‘fish’… And then there’s ‘ci’, which is pronounced similar to ‘s’… The closest I can get is ‘Koshch-oosh-kuh’, but that’s still not it (that would be spelled ‘Koszczuszko’).

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

rootbear 7y ago

There is a small town in Mississippi named Kosciusko, and they pronounce it kosi-'uhskoh, or, in IPA, /ˌkɒsiˈʌskoʊ/. It's not far from my mother's home town and it is the home town of James Meredith and Oprah Winfrey.

perl4ever 7y ago

That's not the Kosciuszko Bridge in NY, this is the Kosciuszko Bridge in NY: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thaddeus_Kosciusko_Bridge https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thaddeus_Kosciusko_Bridge Also, I pronounce it "Ko-shooz-ko".

BrandoElFollito 7y ago

We had the same problem in France with Ms Nathalie Kosciuszko-Morizet (she was a minister). Everybody was calling her NKM.