3 ms·

It's a very good idea because you don't have to hire or retrain the people to perform the work and maintain it. Instead you can just talk about how it'a a good

by blub 7y ago

It's a very good idea because you don't have to hire or retrain the people to perform the work and maintain it. Instead you can just talk about how it'a a good idea.

pjmlp 7y ago
Microsoft security unit also thinks that way. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjbGojjnBZQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjbGojjnBZQ https://github.com/microsoft/MSRC-Security-Research/tree/master/presentations/2019_02_BlueHatIL https://github.com/microsoft/MSRC-Security-Research/tree/mas... "Future development should be a mix of C#, Rust and constrained C++." Which is also a reason why they aren't that bothered into keeping plain old C around on VC++, beyond ISO C++ requirements.
- blub 7y ago
  Microsoft say a lot of things. I'll consider listening when they will (re)write their stuff in Rust. TBH what MS does development-wise is irrelevant for me, since I gave up on their platforms a long time ago. But if they put their money where their mouth is, it might give Rust the push it needs. Wouldn't count on it though, MS can't even figure out what own development story to support for more than a couple of years.
  - pjmlp 7y ago
    Then start listening. Azυre IoT Edge is written in C# and Rust, Visual Studio Code uses Rust for its search, the Web framework Actix is written by Microsoft employees and used internally at Azure, they are helping port Firefox to HoloLens and that included hiring Rust devs.
    - blub 7y ago
      First of all, thanks for letting me know which Rust projects MS are directly or indirectly involved in. It's more than I expected, but only because my expectations were very low. Do you consider that list in any way impressive or representative for the MS organization? I mean writing the search function of their hobby project text editor in language X is not exactly a ringing endorsement. Neither is anything which has IoT in its name.
      - pjmlp 7y ago
        Microsoft security advisor for new projects is C#, Rust and C++ with Core Guidelines profile. So yes, I find relevant that an IT gigant actually cares to spend money on Rust, regardless how much. Rome wasn't built in a day.
pcwalton 7y ago
Thanks for needlessly personalizing the argument, but I've worked on two "rewrite-it-in-Rust" projects that were successes, shipping right now: Stylo and WebRender.
- blub 7y ago
  Third parties pressuring the people doing the work to do more work to satisfy the criteria of said third parties => not ok. 1st parties deciding to rewrite their projects, like in your two examples => sure, it's their projects. There is a special case when new projects are started in C or very security-critical projects are started in C++. Here public interest should take precedence - it's reasonable to criticize the creators of such a project.

by blub 7y ago

It's a very good idea because you don't have to hire or retrain the people to perform the work and maintain it. Instead you can just talk about how it'a a good idea.

pjmlp 7y ago

Microsoft security unit also thinks that way. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjbGojjnBZQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjbGojjnBZQ https://github.com/microsoft/MSRC-Security-Research/tree/master/presentations/2019_02_BlueHatIL https://github.com/microsoft/MSRC-Security-Research/tree/mas... "Future development should be a mix of C#, Rust and constrained C++." Which is also a reason why they aren't that bothered into keeping plain old C around on VC++, beyond ISO C++ requirements.

blub 7y ago
Microsoft say a lot of things. I'll consider listening when they will (re)write their stuff in Rust. TBH what MS does development-wise is irrelevant for me, since I gave up on their platforms a long time ago. But if they put their money where their mouth is, it might give Rust the push it needs. Wouldn't count on it though, MS can't even figure out what own development story to support for more than a couple of years.
- pjmlp 7y ago
  Then start listening. Azυre IoT Edge is written in C# and Rust, Visual Studio Code uses Rust for its search, the Web framework Actix is written by Microsoft employees and used internally at Azure, they are helping port Firefox to HoloLens and that included hiring Rust devs.
  - blub 7y ago
    First of all, thanks for letting me know which Rust projects MS are directly or indirectly involved in. It's more than I expected, but only because my expectations were very low. Do you consider that list in any way impressive or representative for the MS organization? I mean writing the search function of their hobby project text editor in language X is not exactly a ringing endorsement. Neither is anything which has IoT in its name.
    - pjmlp 7y ago
      Microsoft security advisor for new projects is C#, Rust and C++ with Core Guidelines profile. So yes, I find relevant that an IT gigant actually cares to spend money on Rust, regardless how much. Rome wasn't built in a day.

pcwalton 7y ago

Thanks for needlessly personalizing the argument, but I've worked on two "rewrite-it-in-Rust" projects that were successes, shipping right now: Stylo and WebRender.

blub 7y ago
Third parties pressuring the people doing the work to do more work to satisfy the criteria of said third parties => not ok. 1st parties deciding to rewrite their projects, like in your two examples => sure, it's their projects. There is a special case when new projects are started in C or very security-critical projects are started in C++. Here public interest should take precedence - it's reasonable to criticize the creators of such a project.