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> Could it be the case that contemporary governments and economies are just simply not structured to be forward thinking in this way? I'm confused that this is

by fao_ 7y ago

> Could it be the case that contemporary governments and economies are just simply not structured to be forward thinking in this way? I'm confused that this is a quesiton that you're asking, as opposed to something that is blatantly obvious. The United Nations declared as such recently: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/mar/18/ending-climate-change-end-capitalism https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/mar/18/ending... https://www.huffpost.com/entry/climate-change-capitalism-economy_n_5b87bf0ce4b0cf7b00326edc https://www.huffpost.com/entry/climate-change-capitalism-eco... "Trusting that the free market capitalist dynamics will get us there, that of course is not going to happen," report co-author Paavo Järvensivu, an academic who specializes in economics and culture at Bios, says in a phone call with HuffPost. Economies that rely on the power of markets, notes the report, don’t even recognize the problem as they’re too focused on short-term profits to take account of longer-term issues like climate change and environmental destruction.

NeedMoreTea 7y ago
Well going on the tone in the rest of their comment I read that as a firmly tongue in cheek rhetorical question. As in: From the department of the blatantly obvious comes the question "Could it be the case... By analogy to feudalism that we need a transformative change to something, an unknown something, that is different but a little better at seeing a big picture rather than endless blinkered dogma.
tom_mellior 7y ago
That quote is about markets, not governments. It's not great to mix up those two like the parent did. Governments are moving to mitigate climate change. Not all of them at the same pace, and none at the optimal pace, but things are certainly improving on the government front.
- fao_ 7y ago
  Most current governmental structures are innately intwined with the economic system.
  - tom_mellior 7y ago
    Yes, which is why the government can fix what the market messed up, because market participants weren't charged for the costs of the externalities they are responsible for. Carbon taxes can change that.
    - fao_ 7y ago
      At this point, carbon taxes are really pretty much ephemeral, something that is basically too little, too late. You're adding more tax to a pile that the company already doesn't pay.

by fao_ 7y ago

NeedMoreTea 7y ago

Well going on the tone in the rest of their comment I read that as a firmly tongue in cheek rhetorical question. As in: From the department of the blatantly obvious comes the question "Could it be the case... By analogy to feudalism that we need a transformative change to something, an unknown something, that is different but a little better at seeing a big picture rather than endless blinkered dogma.

tom_mellior 7y ago

That quote is about markets, not governments. It's not great to mix up those two like the parent did. Governments are moving to mitigate climate change. Not all of them at the same pace, and none at the optimal pace, but things are certainly improving on the government front.

fao_ 7y ago
Most current governmental structures are innately intwined with the economic system.
- tom_mellior 7y ago
  Yes, which is why the government can fix what the market messed up, because market participants weren't charged for the costs of the externalities they are responsible for. Carbon taxes can change that.
  - fao_ 7y ago
    At this point, carbon taxes are really pretty much ephemeral, something that is basically too little, too late. You're adding more tax to a pile that the company already doesn't pay.