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The biggest problem if you really wanted to do this is that gross and net work aren't the same. And depending on the job, they can be really, REALLY different.

The biggest problem if you really wanted to do this is that gross and net work aren't the same. And depending on the job, they can be really, REALLY different. My wife is a part-time accountant and for her it's working out nicely. She spends maybe 2-3 hours every week on generic stuff like coordination, meetings or bureaucracy which she would also spend at 40h. For Engineers, this ratio is absurdly different. To speak in a cloud metaphor, Engineers are limited by I/O bandwidth and not by compute or RAM. Because you need to learn so much about general coding, languages, algorithms, architecture, frameworks, domain specific expertise and whatnot AS WELL AS coordinate with stakeholders, on-location and upstream contributors, reviewers, managers, architects, QA, ... — they spend maybe 2-3 hours net of _actually writing code_. The rest of the week is spent on how and why to write that code in the first place. Once I understood the fundamental difference, the allure of crunch mode made a whole lot more sense to me. For 10-50% more time, you can get a whopping 100-500% in output for a short time. Compare that with the negative efficiency of adding more people (which, as we all know, will make the project later). A 30h workweek would work into the opposite direction. For 25% less time, you might get 50-70% less productivity. Not gonna happen. Sorry.

snarf21 7y ago
There is a lot of truth to what you say but there is also many studies that show longer hours have a rapid decrease in productivity. Working overtime over extended periods of time has an even larger drop. There is also the thought that someone working a 4 day week for 80% pay is more effective per hour than a person working a 5 day week for 100% pay. The 4 day is generally less stressed and (especially in software) likely to be thinking about the work even on their day off. There are other benefits too of staffing slack. If you do get in a crunch, you could easily pay overtime to the 4 day people to work their old schedule to get something out. This also generally leads to better cross training, vacation coverage and just happier people in general. The loss in net productivity every time an employee quits is huge and it takes time and money to find and train a replacement. I'd would agree that there is a lot of bureaucracy in knowledge worker's days. Cutting that by an hour per day would have similar productivity gains.
didibus 7y ago
Hum, I'm confused about your rationale, your conclusion doesn't seem to follow from your premise. Like for me, all my thinking can happen off work, in the shower, when sleeping, etc. So I really don't need to be at work very much and actively working. And beyond 6h my brain can't produce ideas anymore anyways, so crunch seems useless as a developer, at least for me personally it doesn't make me more productive.
mnm1 7y ago
> For 10-50% more time, you can get a whopping 100-500% in output for a short time. No you can't. Not quality output anyway. After a few hours writing code even the best engineers stop being productive and the quality goes down. From an ignorant manager's perspective this might be true, but it's not reality. Most people cannot code well for more than about five hours or so anyway. There's still plenty of time for bureaucratic bullshit. Of course to managers, people are robots to be pushed to the max and exploited. That's why ridiculous thinking like the above exists. And this isn't even taking into account the negative consequences on the employee being forced to work long hours over even a short period of time like a few days to a week which build up and start to reduce quality even further even in the five or so hours that could be productive. It is just a stupid managerial delusion to think putting in more time coding will be more productive, thinking completely removed from reality.
Tepix 7y ago
I've worked 30 hour weeks (5x6h) for almost 10 years as a software developer. It works for me. It's happening. You don't speak for everyone. "Sorry"

snarf21 7y ago

There is a lot of truth to what you say but there is also many studies that show longer hours have a rapid decrease in productivity. Working overtime over extended periods of time has an even larger drop. There is also the thought that someone working a 4 day week for 80% pay is more effective per hour than a person working a 5 day week for 100% pay. The 4 day is generally less stressed and (especially in software) likely to be thinking about the work even on their day off. There are other benefits too of staffing slack. If you do get in a crunch, you could easily pay overtime to the 4 day people to work their old schedule to get something out. This also generally leads to better cross training, vacation coverage and just happier people in general. The loss in net productivity every time an employee quits is huge and it takes time and money to find and train a replacement. I'd would agree that there is a lot of bureaucracy in knowledge worker's days. Cutting that by an hour per day would have similar productivity gains.

didibus 7y ago

Hum, I'm confused about your rationale, your conclusion doesn't seem to follow from your premise. Like for me, all my thinking can happen off work, in the shower, when sleeping, etc. So I really don't need to be at work very much and actively working. And beyond 6h my brain can't produce ideas anymore anyways, so crunch seems useless as a developer, at least for me personally it doesn't make me more productive.

mnm1 7y ago

> For 10-50% more time, you can get a whopping 100-500% in output for a short time. No you can't. Not quality output anyway. After a few hours writing code even the best engineers stop being productive and the quality goes down. From an ignorant manager's perspective this might be true, but it's not reality. Most people cannot code well for more than about five hours or so anyway. There's still plenty of time for bureaucratic bullshit. Of course to managers, people are robots to be pushed to the max and exploited. That's why ridiculous thinking like the above exists. And this isn't even taking into account the negative consequences on the employee being forced to work long hours over even a short period of time like a few days to a week which build up and start to reduce quality even further even in the five or so hours that could be productive. It is just a stupid managerial delusion to think putting in more time coding will be more productive, thinking completely removed from reality.

Tepix 7y ago

I've worked 30 hour weeks (5x6h) for almost 10 years as a software developer. It works for me. It's happening. You don't speak for everyone. "Sorry"