4 ms·

> But saying that is taboo Still depends in which circles, but I have an impression it's getting better. Might be the bubble effect though, unsure, but before

by stinos 7y ago

> But saying that is taboo Still depends in which circles, but I have an impression it's getting better. Might be the bubble effect though, unsure, but before a couple of years I didn't hear it as much and there definitely weren't small local organizations dedicated to saying it and pushing it on the political agenda. On the other hand, it might be a problem which solves itself (higher lifestyle, less children) but I'm not to sure when or if that is really going to happen.

lisper 7y ago
> it might be a problem which solves itself Yes, that's possible. Economic prosperity does reduce birth rates, and that gives me hope. But it's a race between that and the carbon emissions that will happen on our current trajectory towards that prosperity. Right now it looks to me like the carbon is going to win.
- beat 7y ago
  I don't know if carbon will win or not. Right now, carbon is in a race with renewable energy sources (wind, solar, + storage), and their costs are plummeting while fossil gets more and more expensive. We're already at the tipping point where it's cheaper to build out wind/solar than to build fossil power plants, and it's much cheaper to fuel a car with electricity than gasoline over its lifetime. The population thing is already on a trajectory toward leveling. The main cause of population growth now isn't birth rate, but rather increased lifespans of those born two or three generations ago. If we convert to a renewable energy base before population levels off, we win.
  - QuickToBan 7y ago
    Various governments are still heavily subsidizing fossil fuels, and so it's an unfair game. How can renewables win in this scenario...
    - jsnider3 7y ago
      Lobbying and voting for pro-renewable politicians (or at least those that are neutral).
    - beat 7y ago
      They won't keep doing it. The advantages of renewables are too strong. The thing about politicians that can be bought, is that someone else can buy them, too. If they're not ideologically committed to the cause, if it's just political, then they'll turn on the cause in the name of either ideological goals or simple practicality. There's a hard limit to how much harm a politician is willing to do to their own country in order to placate special interests with nothing to offer but money.

by stinos 7y ago

lisper 7y ago

> it might be a problem which solves itself Yes, that's possible. Economic prosperity does reduce birth rates, and that gives me hope. But it's a race between that and the carbon emissions that will happen on our current trajectory towards that prosperity. Right now it looks to me like the carbon is going to win.

beat 7y ago
I don't know if carbon will win or not. Right now, carbon is in a race with renewable energy sources (wind, solar, + storage), and their costs are plummeting while fossil gets more and more expensive. We're already at the tipping point where it's cheaper to build out wind/solar than to build fossil power plants, and it's much cheaper to fuel a car with electricity than gasoline over its lifetime. The population thing is already on a trajectory toward leveling. The main cause of population growth now isn't birth rate, but rather increased lifespans of those born two or three generations ago. If we convert to a renewable energy base before population levels off, we win.
- QuickToBan 7y ago
  Various governments are still heavily subsidizing fossil fuels, and so it's an unfair game. How can renewables win in this scenario...
  - jsnider3 7y ago
    Lobbying and voting for pro-renewable politicians (or at least those that are neutral).
  - beat 7y ago
    They won't keep doing it. The advantages of renewables are too strong. The thing about politicians that can be bought, is that someone else can buy them, too. If they're not ideologically committed to the cause, if it's just political, then they'll turn on the cause in the name of either ideological goals or simple practicality. There's a hard limit to how much harm a politician is willing to do to their own country in order to placate special interests with nothing to offer but money.