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This is exactly how all cryptocurrencies already are allowed to operate. Any domestic crypto exchange has to do KYC, but also cooperate with the IRS. With most

This is exactly how all cryptocurrencies already are allowed to operate. Any domestic crypto exchange has to do KYC, but also cooperate with the IRS. With most cryptocurrencies, transactions are public and traceable.

sametmax 7y ago
You mean exchanges. Exchanges != crypto. Individuals can use btc anonymously. It's public, but only the person you deal with know who owns your wallet.
- gridlockd 7y ago
  Those exchanges are those "on and off ramps" that the Facebook is talking about here. Otherwise, Libra can be used "anonymously" just like Bitcoin. You download a client, you generate an identity and then you can receive/send it. https://developers.libra.org/docs/my-first-transaction#create-alice-s-and-bob-s-account https://developers.libra.org/docs/my-first-transaction#creat... That's why the whole money laundering issue comes up in the first place, because Libra is a cryptocurrency much like many others. Its distinction is really that it's not decentralized (like Ripple), that it's backed by real assets (like Tether - supposedly) and that Facebook and some other big corps are involved. Those are all reasons for crypto-idealists to hate on it and spread FUD, which the Facebook-hating rest of the interest readily gobbles up. In practice, those are all reasons for Libra to actually work as a means of exchange, as opposed to a highly speculative risk asset. Ripple transactions are instant. Tether price is stable, despite its sketchy background. Big corporations can influence points-of-sale.
  - democracy 7y ago
    What we call a "cryptocurrency" must be decentralised otherwise it is a Paypal version X. Ripple is 100% centralised by the way.
    - jki275 7y ago
      I would agree. Ripple is not considered a cryptocurrency by most, as it is simply a centrally validated bank coin.
    - gridlockd 7y ago
      Who is "we"? Ripple (or rather XRP, which I referred to as "Ripple") is widely referred to as cryptocurrency. It uses a distributed ledger and cryptography, like a cryptocurrency. It is traded on cryptocurrency exchanges and can be sent/received like a cryptocurrency (requiring no account registration like Paypal). Also, like most cryptocurrency it is backed by nothing and its price fluctuates and moves along with broader cryptocurrency market trends. For most intents and purposes, it is a cryptocurrency. Of course one can make the distinction that a "true" cryptocurrency should be fully decentralized, but that's besides my point.
      - democracy 7y ago
        If it is not decentralised it defies the whole point of the solution. You then don't need a distributed decentralised network of independent transaction validators aka miners. You don't need any blockchain solution for it all. You can as well stick with MySQL and call it PayPal v2. Paypal also uses a lot of "cryptography" in its solutions but it doesn't make it a cryptocurrency. How many validation nodes are there in ripple? Less than a hundred. Can someone with bad intention and CPU power overtake it? No. It is a payment solution that is using parts of bitcoin ideas for no reason, really, rather than making quick cash on the hype.
        gridlockd 7y ago
        Fundamentally I think both XRP and Bitcoin are equally worthless tokens with little practical use. However, XRP at least doesn't waste a huge amount of electricity in the process of sending those tokens around - and it does so instantly. That's a consequence of not being fully decentralized and trustless. Another consequence is that it isn't vulnerable to a 51% attack or a 33% attack. Of course the market says both of these tokens are worth billions in market cap. It treats it exactly like a cryptocurrency, feeding on the cryptocurrency hype. Clearly the market doesn't value decentralization to the point where XRP is shunned.
  - Lucadg 7y ago
    "Otherwise, Libra can be used "anonymously" just like Bitcoin. You download a client, you generate an identity and then you can receive/send it." Bitcoin can be used anonymously if you avoid KYC on/off ramps and specific transactions tied to your identity. Hard but possible. From Libra's white paper this appears impossible. That's a big difference.
    - gridlockd 7y ago
      > From Libra's white paper this appears impossible. How so? Can you be specific? I quote the whitepaper: "The Libra Blockchain is pseudonymous and allows users to hold one or more addresses that are not linked to their real-world identity." The only difference that I see is that you could mine Bitcoin anonymously. You could also buy Bitcoin with cash in a private transaction, but the same can be said for Libra.

sametmax 7y ago

You mean exchanges. Exchanges != crypto. Individuals can use btc anonymously. It's public, but only the person you deal with know who owns your wallet.

gridlockd 7y ago
Those exchanges are those "on and off ramps" that the Facebook is talking about here. Otherwise, Libra can be used "anonymously" just like Bitcoin. You download a client, you generate an identity and then you can receive/send it. https://developers.libra.org/docs/my-first-transaction#create-alice-s-and-bob-s-account https://developers.libra.org/docs/my-first-transaction#creat... That's why the whole money laundering issue comes up in the first place, because Libra is a cryptocurrency much like many others. Its distinction is really that it's not decentralized (like Ripple), that it's backed by real assets (like Tether - supposedly) and that Facebook and some other big corps are involved. Those are all reasons for crypto-idealists to hate on it and spread FUD, which the Facebook-hating rest of the interest readily gobbles up. In practice, those are all reasons for Libra to actually work as a means of exchange, as opposed to a highly speculative risk asset. Ripple transactions are instant. Tether price is stable, despite its sketchy background. Big corporations can influence points-of-sale.
- democracy 7y ago
  What we call a "cryptocurrency" must be decentralised otherwise it is a Paypal version X. Ripple is 100% centralised by the way.
  - jki275 7y ago
    I would agree. Ripple is not considered a cryptocurrency by most, as it is simply a centrally validated bank coin.
  - gridlockd 7y ago
    Who is "we"? Ripple (or rather XRP, which I referred to as "Ripple") is widely referred to as cryptocurrency. It uses a distributed ledger and cryptography, like a cryptocurrency. It is traded on cryptocurrency exchanges and can be sent/received like a cryptocurrency (requiring no account registration like Paypal). Also, like most cryptocurrency it is backed by nothing and its price fluctuates and moves along with broader cryptocurrency market trends. For most intents and purposes, it is a cryptocurrency. Of course one can make the distinction that a "true" cryptocurrency should be fully decentralized, but that's besides my point.
    - democracy 7y ago
      If it is not decentralised it defies the whole point of the solution. You then don't need a distributed decentralised network of independent transaction validators aka miners. You don't need any blockchain solution for it all. You can as well stick with MySQL and call it PayPal v2. Paypal also uses a lot of "cryptography" in its solutions but it doesn't make it a cryptocurrency. How many validation nodes are there in ripple? Less than a hundred. Can someone with bad intention and CPU power overtake it? No. It is a payment solution that is using parts of bitcoin ideas for no reason, really, rather than making quick cash on the hype.
      - gridlockd 7y ago
        Fundamentally I think both XRP and Bitcoin are equally worthless tokens with little practical use. However, XRP at least doesn't waste a huge amount of electricity in the process of sending those tokens around - and it does so instantly. That's a consequence of not being fully decentralized and trustless. Another consequence is that it isn't vulnerable to a 51% attack or a 33% attack. Of course the market says both of these tokens are worth billions in market cap. It treats it exactly like a cryptocurrency, feeding on the cryptocurrency hype. Clearly the market doesn't value decentralization to the point where XRP is shunned.
- Lucadg 7y ago
  "Otherwise, Libra can be used "anonymously" just like Bitcoin. You download a client, you generate an identity and then you can receive/send it." Bitcoin can be used anonymously if you avoid KYC on/off ramps and specific transactions tied to your identity. Hard but possible. From Libra's white paper this appears impossible. That's a big difference.
  - gridlockd 7y ago
    > From Libra's white paper this appears impossible. How so? Can you be specific? I quote the whitepaper: "The Libra Blockchain is pseudonymous and allows users to hold one or more addresses that are not linked to their real-world identity." The only difference that I see is that you could mine Bitcoin anonymously. You could also buy Bitcoin with cash in a private transaction, but the same can be said for Libra.