5 ms·

Posts like these give me some hope. I am 37 and lost. The work and career which once brought pleasure now seems drudgery. The daily morning battle is: "Is it

Posts like these give me some hope. I am 37 and lost. The work and career which once brought pleasure now seems drudgery. The daily morning battle is: "Is it worth it?". There is no answer to the question.

tonymet 7y ago
mind if I ask what changed?
- sidcool 7y ago
  I wish I could figure out. My best guesses are: 1. I am getting older and not doing anything remotely impactful. 2. People half my age know all the programming I know. I don't bring anything special to the table. 3. Is this what life is all about? Now, I don't say the problem is with the world. Something could be wrong with me. But damned if I know.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - solresol 7y ago
    I have nothing to do with this thread, but felt like answering anyway... 1. Very few people leave a legacy. The people that do often didn't do it deliberately or intentionally. 2. They don't. There might be a few people half your age that know as much about programming as you do, but the majority don't. In any case, you are the worst person to judge what special thing you bring to the table. Go and ask one of these young people that you fear / respect / admire / think are knowledgeable and ask them to tell you what value you bring. The answer will surprise you. 3. A lot of people have pondered the meaning of life. Opinions differ on whether we've made any progress on that question. It's OK to go on a journey of "spiritual discovery" at 37; it doesn't require heading overseas to a monastery.
    - sidcool 7y ago
      Thanks for your reply. I would love to take a break and explore the spiritual side of me, but it would need too much of rearranging my life and it may not be worth it. As such I am scared of drastic change, this would just add to the anxiety. Anything I can do with my current flow of life?
      - scns 7y ago
        Start meditating, check out the book "Mind Illuminated"
        hellfrick 7y ago
        +1 for "Mind Illuminated". Culadasa has done great work in synthesising many techniques - try it!
      - kalms 7y ago
        I feel compelled to answer here, mostly because I've been and to a degree still are where you are. It's extremely common to gradually move into a state of mind where you denigrate yourself – and the effort you've put forth in life. You need to ensure your own happiness, and no one in here, or anywhere else, can tell you how to do that. Mindfulness is a great tool, because it allows you to become more certain of yourself. To discover what it is that you feel and where it is you need to go. That being said, here's what works for me: Acknowledging that creation is hard, but that I love creating and helping people around me. That family is important and love even more so. I also remind myself to do something new every day that somehow moves the boundary of what it means to be me. Added note: A book that also helped me realise my own tendency to create barriers around myself was "The Flinch" by Julien Smith. It's awesome and I highly recommend giving it a read – and practice some of what it champions. I suspect you will gain a lot from it, but then again: Only you can know that.
      - sjg007 7y ago
        Read some philosophy books. I like pondering koans too. Some other things might be to start enjoying community.
  - mLuby 7y ago
    Not all impact needs to be at-scale. Perhaps you can make a difference outside of work, and/or at a local or individual level? While the systems crowd that congregates on HN may discount this kind of "last mile" effort, it can be deeply fulfilling (we are social animals after all) and have life-altering positive effects on recipients. I don't know if that speaks to your situation at all. Either way, I wish you (individually) self-understanding and happiness. ^__^
  - it_aint_that 7y ago
    Have you tried going to church and making babies? Serious question.
  - bedobi 7y ago
    "...demanding excellence in all that we do ...steals from us one of life’s greatest rewards — the simple pleasure of doing something you merely, but truly, enjoy" https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/29/opinion/sunday/in-praise-of-mediocrity.html https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/29/opinion/sunday/in-praise-...
  - circlefavshape 7y ago
    There's nothing wrong with you - I'm guessing you just had, like most of us, a fantasy about shaking up the world somehow. Time to give up on the fantasy and engage with your actual real life instead
    - rxhernandez 7y ago
      Good god this is awful advice. There are plenty of people that have made their only great contributions to humanity in advanced age (not that late 30s is even remotely advanced). If you gave up on dreams, fine; but don't go on encouraging others to do the same just because you lack the drive and became complacent with giving up. Moreover, there are so many things that need doing that are plenty impactful and just require discipline to do it frequently; that you never bothered to think of other ways to make an impact shouldn't mean you should dissuade others from finding out new ways to make an impact. Lastly, there is precisely zero evidence that you get another shot at life so it's grossly irresponsible to push people into thinking that their dreams and their real life should be readjusted into some bullshit dichotomy of fantasy vs real life. (I have heard people in their early 20s giving this same advice; Good god could you imagine the world if people stopped following their dreams so early in life) (I was a C/D student in STEM subjects by the end of high school. I can't imagine what my life would be like if I didn't kick it into overdrive, thereby managing to get involved with some of the most prolific scientists on this planet and getting my name on a few papers; actually I can imagine, I would have blown my brains out because my life was incredibly miserable up until then)
      - sidcool 7y ago
        Thanks for your encouraging words. Sadly, I have given up on grand ambitions (pragmatically).
      - sireat 7y ago
        It is pragmatic advice. “Until a man is twenty-five, he still thinks, every so often, that under the right circumstances he could be the baddest motherfucker in the world.” If you are in your mid 40s you are not going to become great at something new to you (painting, quantum physics, chess, programming, etc etc). It is nice to dream of that, but it does not happen. You might become decent and contribute to society in your new skill but that's different. Who are those people who have made a single great contribution at an advanced age (let's say past 50)? The few that I can think of (like that obscure mathematician who didn't get tenure and did his research alone) labored in their calling starting in their 20s at the latest. The one exception could be business success which indeed is possible even at a very late age(Colonel Sanders etc)
  - boca 7y ago
    What has helped me is talking in person to someone who is close. Realized that sometimes I just need to vent my inner confusion and at other times I need them to shake me because I am living too much in my head. Over time, I realized that this situation occurs because there's something that I must/need to do but I am procrastinating. That surfaces as anxiety and my mind ends up "translating" it into a spiritual discussion - all in my head - with questions like "is this life", "is this all"? Expectations of self can be hard and confusing.
kirse 7y ago
Are you really lost if you can recognize you're lost? I always figure the point of spiritual malaise and existential wandering is to prune away the false hopes and beliefs that keep us mildly entertained and encourage us to seek out eternal hopes that provide daily rejuvenation. Ecclesiastes is always a comforting read whenever I feel that way: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Ecclesiastes+1&version=NIV https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Ecclesiastes+1&...
- solveit 7y ago
  You are if you can't figure out where to go.
- cableshaft 7y ago
  I'd never given that book of the Bible a serious read before. Turns out I should have earlier. Very interesting. Thanks!
llamataboot 7y ago
Might I suggest, with sincerity and humbleness, that the question is a very good start and maybe it's not uncertainty holding you back but fear? Where do you go when you keep asking "I'm dying, not much time left, is it worth it?" I mean, is it?
- sidcool 7y ago
  That's the one! It's next to impossible to go beyond that question. Where do you go from there? And you are spot on with the 'fear' part.
  - ScottFree 7y ago
    Isn't the next logical question "what makes life worth living?"
  - llamataboot 7y ago
    You listen for the small voice inside of you that knows what it wants, you protect it from all the other voices inside of you that will shout at it for being unrealistic, or selfish, or naive, etc. And you follow as best you can...
denzil 7y ago
Feeling quite similar and only a little bit younger than you. I just rediscovered LessWrong (because of Pokemon fanfiction) and I think it might be worth for you to have a look at the Hammertime series: https://www.lesswrong.com/s/qRxTKm7DAftSuTGvj https://www.lesswrong.com/s/qRxTKm7DAftSuTGvj LessWrong has it's problems, like lots of jargon, but this series seems like good tool to clean up life a bit. Especially I recommend having look at the Aversion factoring and Goal factoring, those two seem to be the most useful ones to deal with having lost some kind of "life purpose". Though I have to admit I still haven't found my solution, so take my post with a grain of salt. But at least I feel like I'm working on it in the right direction.
dgjrhgi 7y ago
Me too.Little less age but same feeling. Thinking if job/team change would help.

tonymet 7y ago

mind if I ask what changed?

sidcool 7y ago
I wish I could figure out. My best guesses are: 1. I am getting older and not doing anything remotely impactful. 2. People half my age know all the programming I know. I don't bring anything special to the table. 3. Is this what life is all about? Now, I don't say the problem is with the world. Something could be wrong with me. But damned if I know.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- solresol 7y ago
  I have nothing to do with this thread, but felt like answering anyway... 1. Very few people leave a legacy. The people that do often didn't do it deliberately or intentionally. 2. They don't. There might be a few people half your age that know as much about programming as you do, but the majority don't. In any case, you are the worst person to judge what special thing you bring to the table. Go and ask one of these young people that you fear / respect / admire / think are knowledgeable and ask them to tell you what value you bring. The answer will surprise you. 3. A lot of people have pondered the meaning of life. Opinions differ on whether we've made any progress on that question. It's OK to go on a journey of "spiritual discovery" at 37; it doesn't require heading overseas to a monastery.
  - sidcool 7y ago
    Thanks for your reply. I would love to take a break and explore the spiritual side of me, but it would need too much of rearranging my life and it may not be worth it. As such I am scared of drastic change, this would just add to the anxiety. Anything I can do with my current flow of life?
    - scns 7y ago
      Start meditating, check out the book "Mind Illuminated"
      - hellfrick 7y ago
        +1 for "Mind Illuminated". Culadasa has done great work in synthesising many techniques - try it!
    - kalms 7y ago
      I feel compelled to answer here, mostly because I've been and to a degree still are where you are. It's extremely common to gradually move into a state of mind where you denigrate yourself – and the effort you've put forth in life. You need to ensure your own happiness, and no one in here, or anywhere else, can tell you how to do that. Mindfulness is a great tool, because it allows you to become more certain of yourself. To discover what it is that you feel and where it is you need to go. That being said, here's what works for me: Acknowledging that creation is hard, but that I love creating and helping people around me. That family is important and love even more so. I also remind myself to do something new every day that somehow moves the boundary of what it means to be me. Added note: A book that also helped me realise my own tendency to create barriers around myself was "The Flinch" by Julien Smith. It's awesome and I highly recommend giving it a read – and practice some of what it champions. I suspect you will gain a lot from it, but then again: Only you can know that.
    - sjg007 7y ago
      Read some philosophy books. I like pondering koans too. Some other things might be to start enjoying community.
- mLuby 7y ago
  Not all impact needs to be at-scale. Perhaps you can make a difference outside of work, and/or at a local or individual level? While the systems crowd that congregates on HN may discount this kind of "last mile" effort, it can be deeply fulfilling (we are social animals after all) and have life-altering positive effects on recipients. I don't know if that speaks to your situation at all. Either way, I wish you (individually) self-understanding and happiness. ^__^
- it_aint_that 7y ago
  Have you tried going to church and making babies? Serious question.
- bedobi 7y ago
  "...demanding excellence in all that we do ...steals from us one of life’s greatest rewards — the simple pleasure of doing something you merely, but truly, enjoy" https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/29/opinion/sunday/in-praise-of-mediocrity.html https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/29/opinion/sunday/in-praise-...
- circlefavshape 7y ago
  There's nothing wrong with you - I'm guessing you just had, like most of us, a fantasy about shaking up the world somehow. Time to give up on the fantasy and engage with your actual real life instead
  - rxhernandez 7y ago
    Good god this is awful advice. There are plenty of people that have made their only great contributions to humanity in advanced age (not that late 30s is even remotely advanced). If you gave up on dreams, fine; but don't go on encouraging others to do the same just because you lack the drive and became complacent with giving up. Moreover, there are so many things that need doing that are plenty impactful and just require discipline to do it frequently; that you never bothered to think of other ways to make an impact shouldn't mean you should dissuade others from finding out new ways to make an impact. Lastly, there is precisely zero evidence that you get another shot at life so it's grossly irresponsible to push people into thinking that their dreams and their real life should be readjusted into some bullshit dichotomy of fantasy vs real life. (I have heard people in their early 20s giving this same advice; Good god could you imagine the world if people stopped following their dreams so early in life) (I was a C/D student in STEM subjects by the end of high school. I can't imagine what my life would be like if I didn't kick it into overdrive, thereby managing to get involved with some of the most prolific scientists on this planet and getting my name on a few papers; actually I can imagine, I would have blown my brains out because my life was incredibly miserable up until then)
    - sidcool 7y ago
      Thanks for your encouraging words. Sadly, I have given up on grand ambitions (pragmatically).
    - sireat 7y ago
      It is pragmatic advice. “Until a man is twenty-five, he still thinks, every so often, that under the right circumstances he could be the baddest motherfucker in the world.” If you are in your mid 40s you are not going to become great at something new to you (painting, quantum physics, chess, programming, etc etc). It is nice to dream of that, but it does not happen. You might become decent and contribute to society in your new skill but that's different. Who are those people who have made a single great contribution at an advanced age (let's say past 50)? The few that I can think of (like that obscure mathematician who didn't get tenure and did his research alone) labored in their calling starting in their 20s at the latest. The one exception could be business success which indeed is possible even at a very late age(Colonel Sanders etc)
- boca 7y ago
  What has helped me is talking in person to someone who is close. Realized that sometimes I just need to vent my inner confusion and at other times I need them to shake me because I am living too much in my head. Over time, I realized that this situation occurs because there's something that I must/need to do but I am procrastinating. That surfaces as anxiety and my mind ends up "translating" it into a spiritual discussion - all in my head - with questions like "is this life", "is this all"? Expectations of self can be hard and confusing.

kirse 7y ago

Are you really lost if you can recognize you're lost? I always figure the point of spiritual malaise and existential wandering is to prune away the false hopes and beliefs that keep us mildly entertained and encourage us to seek out eternal hopes that provide daily rejuvenation. Ecclesiastes is always a comforting read whenever I feel that way: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Ecclesiastes+1&version=NIV https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Ecclesiastes+1&...

solveit 7y ago
You are if you can't figure out where to go.
cableshaft 7y ago
I'd never given that book of the Bible a serious read before. Turns out I should have earlier. Very interesting. Thanks!

llamataboot 7y ago

Might I suggest, with sincerity and humbleness, that the question is a very good start and maybe it's not uncertainty holding you back but fear? Where do you go when you keep asking "I'm dying, not much time left, is it worth it?" I mean, is it?

sidcool 7y ago
That's the one! It's next to impossible to go beyond that question. Where do you go from there? And you are spot on with the 'fear' part.
- ScottFree 7y ago
  Isn't the next logical question "what makes life worth living?"
- llamataboot 7y ago
  You listen for the small voice inside of you that knows what it wants, you protect it from all the other voices inside of you that will shout at it for being unrealistic, or selfish, or naive, etc. And you follow as best you can...

denzil 7y ago

Feeling quite similar and only a little bit younger than you. I just rediscovered LessWrong (because of Pokemon fanfiction) and I think it might be worth for you to have a look at the Hammertime series: https://www.lesswrong.com/s/qRxTKm7DAftSuTGvj https://www.lesswrong.com/s/qRxTKm7DAftSuTGvj LessWrong has it's problems, like lots of jargon, but this series seems like good tool to clean up life a bit. Especially I recommend having look at the Aversion factoring and Goal factoring, those two seem to be the most useful ones to deal with having lost some kind of "life purpose". Though I have to admit I still haven't found my solution, so take my post with a grain of salt. But at least I feel like I'm working on it in the right direction.

dgjrhgi 7y ago

Me too.Little less age but same feeling. Thinking if job/team change would help.