8 ms·

These examples posted so far all seem to fall into the "What You Can't Say" heresy camp, rather than actual overt racism. I can't speak for his character in gen

These examples posted so far all seem to fall into the "What You Can't Say" heresy camp, rather than actual overt racism. I can't speak for his character in general, but the stuff here comes off entirely as him having different political beliefs, a lack of tact, and the nerve to speak about his beliefs publicly.

DonHopkins 7y ago
I've known him and RMS (who he's made his career trying to destroy) for well over 30 years, so I can testify that ESR has always been insufferably narcissistic, arrogant, and smarmy, but 9/11 sent him over the deep end of racism, islamophobia and misogyny (google "Is the casting couch a fair trade?"). His software work is unremarkable (fetchmail is trivial and buggy, and CML2 was rejected by the Linux kernel developers), and he's made his career not by writing software but by attacking real hackers like Richard Stallman and trying to bring down their work, not by actually constructively developing any useful software himself. Attacking real hackers and trying to discourage people from using "free software" isn't "hacking". He used to call himself "Eric the Flute", and he would go on and on ad nauseum about his beloved "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle NetNews Reader" and how it was so much better than every other netnews reader. But he never collaborated with anyone, and he never released it under any license. Much more Bizarre than Cathedral. Just keep reading the other posts and quotes in this threads. You have a lot of catching up to do if you're still not convinced he's racist, assuming you're not just another one of his racist sycophants trying to rationalize his beliefs, carry his water, and mansplain away his racism. See his blog for many more examples of his racist statements ("Affirmative action _is_ racism, by definition." -ESR) and his followers sucking up to him. https://twitter.com/tqbf/status/780839196231630848 https://twitter.com/tqbf/status/780839196231630848 He has a huge following of racist alt-right pro-gun whack jobs (even the occasional self-loathing gay brony, not to mention "Tron Guy") who he panders to. Yes. THAT "Tron Guy": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9dutFhebw4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9dutFhebw4
- mises 7y ago
  I absolutely agree that he significantly overblows his technical acumen, and appears to make his name as a sort of ex-spokesman for open source. As you said, it seems that he's unfortunately moved more toward attacking others, which is sad. > assuming you're not just another one of his racist sycophants. Implying that all who do not agree with you are racist is a bit of a weighty allegation. I have no doubt you will call me a racist sycophant in retaliation. This is not to say I agree with him; I don't. > mansplain away his racism. Please don't use this term. It implies someone is doing something because of gender; how do you know the gender of the explainer? Or of all the explainees? It's a silly term used to attack certain points of view. If some one is a condescending horse's rear, just call him a condescending horse's rear. > Affirmative action _is_ racism, by definition This is a point agreed upon by many. Half the nation doesn't agree with you. This includes non-whites; it isn't fair to assume that every one who doesn't agree with you is racist. > He has a huge following of racist alt-right pro-gun whack jobs Guilt by association is not fair. Just because some one agrees with something I say doesn't mean I agree with what he says. Also, again not fair trying to paint all pro-gun people as whack jobs; much of the country disagrees with you. In summary, you make generally good points, but adulterate them with a political message hostile to many. You needlessly attack people for political beliefs which are reasonably main-stream, thus turning them away from otherwise good points about ESR's deficiencies. Discussion on this ought to stay intellectual, rather than devolving into personal attacks on vast swathes of people you have never met or conversed with.
  - DonHopkins 7y ago
    >Implying that all who do not agree with you are racist is a bit of a weighty allegation. Quite the contrary. I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt that you're not one of his racist sycophants. >> mansplain away his racism. >Please don't use this term. Every one of his racist sycophants I've ever encountered have been men. Perhaps his Sex Tips for Geeks don't make him and his ideas as attractive to women as he thinks they do. http://www.catb.org/esr/writings/sextips/ http://www.catb.org/esr/writings/sextips/ >>Affirmative action _is_ racism, by definition >This is a point agreed upon by many. Many who have an extremely simplistic, distorted understanding of what racism is. That doesn't make them right. >In summary, you make generally good points, but adulterate them with a political message hostile to many. If anybody wants to ignore the objective facts I've presented because I hurt their feelings by implicitly criticizing their political beliefs by associating them with Eric Raymond's racist beliefs, then that's their problem. If they don't have a problem with the hostile political messages that ESR adulterates all of his arguments with, then they should be able to tolerate mine too. Perhaps they should read ESR's Sex Tips For Geeks advice about Avoiding the Curse of Oversensitivity: http://www.catb.org/esr/writings/sextips/oversensitivity.html http://www.catb.org/esr/writings/sextips/oversensitivity.htm... >"As one of my beautiful geekgirl assistants pointed out previously, women have egos too." -Eric S Raymond

DonHopkins 7y ago

I've known him and RMS (who he's made his career trying to destroy) for well over 30 years, so I can testify that ESR has always been insufferably narcissistic, arrogant, and smarmy, but 9/11 sent him over the deep end of racism, islamophobia and misogyny (google "Is the casting couch a fair trade?"). His software work is unremarkable (fetchmail is trivial and buggy, and CML2 was rejected by the Linux kernel developers), and he's made his career not by writing software but by attacking real hackers like Richard Stallman and trying to bring down their work, not by actually constructively developing any useful software himself. Attacking real hackers and trying to discourage people from using "free software" isn't "hacking". He used to call himself "Eric the Flute", and he would go on and on ad nauseum about his beloved "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle NetNews Reader" and how it was so much better than every other netnews reader. But he never collaborated with anyone, and he never released it under any license. Much more Bizarre than Cathedral. Just keep reading the other posts and quotes in this threads. You have a lot of catching up to do if you're still not convinced he's racist, assuming you're not just another one of his racist sycophants trying to rationalize his beliefs, carry his water, and mansplain away his racism. See his blog for many more examples of his racist statements ("Affirmative action _is_ racism, by definition." -ESR) and his followers sucking up to him. https://twitter.com/tqbf/status/780839196231630848 https://twitter.com/tqbf/status/780839196231630848 He has a huge following of racist alt-right pro-gun whack jobs (even the occasional self-loathing gay brony, not to mention "Tron Guy") who he panders to. Yes. THAT "Tron Guy": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9dutFhebw4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9dutFhebw4

mises 7y ago
I absolutely agree that he significantly overblows his technical acumen, and appears to make his name as a sort of ex-spokesman for open source. As you said, it seems that he's unfortunately moved more toward attacking others, which is sad. > assuming you're not just another one of his racist sycophants. Implying that all who do not agree with you are racist is a bit of a weighty allegation. I have no doubt you will call me a racist sycophant in retaliation. This is not to say I agree with him; I don't. > mansplain away his racism. Please don't use this term. It implies someone is doing something because of gender; how do you know the gender of the explainer? Or of all the explainees? It's a silly term used to attack certain points of view. If some one is a condescending horse's rear, just call him a condescending horse's rear. > Affirmative action _is_ racism, by definition This is a point agreed upon by many. Half the nation doesn't agree with you. This includes non-whites; it isn't fair to assume that every one who doesn't agree with you is racist. > He has a huge following of racist alt-right pro-gun whack jobs Guilt by association is not fair. Just because some one agrees with something I say doesn't mean I agree with what he says. Also, again not fair trying to paint all pro-gun people as whack jobs; much of the country disagrees with you. In summary, you make generally good points, but adulterate them with a political message hostile to many. You needlessly attack people for political beliefs which are reasonably main-stream, thus turning them away from otherwise good points about ESR's deficiencies. Discussion on this ought to stay intellectual, rather than devolving into personal attacks on vast swathes of people you have never met or conversed with.
- DonHopkins 7y ago
  >Implying that all who do not agree with you are racist is a bit of a weighty allegation. Quite the contrary. I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt that you're not one of his racist sycophants. >> mansplain away his racism. >Please don't use this term. Every one of his racist sycophants I've ever encountered have been men. Perhaps his Sex Tips for Geeks don't make him and his ideas as attractive to women as he thinks they do. http://www.catb.org/esr/writings/sextips/ http://www.catb.org/esr/writings/sextips/ >>Affirmative action _is_ racism, by definition >This is a point agreed upon by many. Many who have an extremely simplistic, distorted understanding of what racism is. That doesn't make them right. >In summary, you make generally good points, but adulterate them with a political message hostile to many. If anybody wants to ignore the objective facts I've presented because I hurt their feelings by implicitly criticizing their political beliefs by associating them with Eric Raymond's racist beliefs, then that's their problem. If they don't have a problem with the hostile political messages that ESR adulterates all of his arguments with, then they should be able to tolerate mine too. Perhaps they should read ESR's Sex Tips For Geeks advice about Avoiding the Curse of Oversensitivity: http://www.catb.org/esr/writings/sextips/oversensitivity.html http://www.catb.org/esr/writings/sextips/oversensitivity.htm... >"As one of my beautiful geekgirl assistants pointed out previously, women have egos too." -Eric S Raymond