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AMDs really had some amazing improvements, are they close to reaching the limits on this architecture? When should we expect the next major architecture change?

by archy_ 7y ago

SketchySeaBeast 7y ago
Does this move to 7nm with better ICP not count? The committed to supporting the AM4 form-factor for 5 years - I imagine we won't see anything more revolutionary until after that point, especially as they are getting close to parity (if they aren't already exceeding) with Intel.
jhasse 7y ago
Isn't Zen 2 a new architecture??
- opencl 7y ago
  It's an update to Zen+, though a pretty big one. The last few "new" AMD designs were K10 in 2007, Bulldozer in 2011, Zen in 2017. Intel hasn't done a ground-up redesign in over a decade.
  - amaranth 7y ago
    Haswell was a pretty major change though, even if it wasn't from scratch. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Although with Meltdown and L1TF and ZombieLoad clearly, it is kind of broken...
    - opencl 7y ago
      Yeah there's not really a hard line between "improved version of old architecture" and "new architecture". Zen 2 seems to be about as big a change from Zen+ as Haswell was from Ivy Bridge. Ultimately what matters is how much they improved from the old versions. Supposedly Ice Lake is going to have 18% higher IPC than Skylake which seems like it will involve some pretty radical changes. Will certainly be interesting to see how that and Zen 3 turn out.
zamadatix 7y ago
Zen 3 is due 2020 but I personally don't think it will be a very big iteration. Zen 4 is roadmapped to follow up and will likely change the socket as well as represent a node shrink, I'd say this one has the most potential for further shake up on the design. The popular thing to talk about in the rumor mills has been if they continue to make it any wider SMT4 as seen in Power may come about. Personally I think the IO die has the best chance for improvements though, especially towards EPYC parts which have up to 8 CCXs and a crazy memory controller to interconnect.
- ksec 7y ago
  Zen 4 is a new socket. Which really give AMD a chance to support DDR5 along with PCI-E 5.0. Definitely agree on the IO die. Not sure what plan AMD has with IO die, currently it is on 14nm only to use up all the Wafer Agreement that had with GF, and we are not sure how long that agreement last or if it makes sense to switch the IO die to FD-SOI which is GF's forte at the moment. But like Dr Lisa Su had said, it is important to shown their clients that they stick to their roadmap and execute it to perfection. Something Intel hasn't been doing for the past 3- 4 years.

AMDs really had some amazing improvements, are they close to reaching the limits on this architecture? When should we expect the next major architecture change?

by archy_ 7y ago

AMDs really had some amazing improvements, are they close to reaching the limits on this architecture? When should we expect the next major architecture change?

SketchySeaBeast 7y ago

Does this move to 7nm with better ICP not count? The committed to supporting the AM4 form-factor for 5 years - I imagine we won't see anything more revolutionary until after that point, especially as they are getting close to parity (if they aren't already exceeding) with Intel.

jhasse 7y ago

Isn't Zen 2 a new architecture??

opencl 7y ago
It's an update to Zen+, though a pretty big one. The last few "new" AMD designs were K10 in 2007, Bulldozer in 2011, Zen in 2017. Intel hasn't done a ground-up redesign in over a decade.
- amaranth 7y ago
  Haswell was a pretty major change though, even if it wasn't from scratch. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Although with Meltdown and L1TF and ZombieLoad clearly, it is kind of broken...
  - opencl 7y ago
    Yeah there's not really a hard line between "improved version of old architecture" and "new architecture". Zen 2 seems to be about as big a change from Zen+ as Haswell was from Ivy Bridge. Ultimately what matters is how much they improved from the old versions. Supposedly Ice Lake is going to have 18% higher IPC than Skylake which seems like it will involve some pretty radical changes. Will certainly be interesting to see how that and Zen 3 turn out.

zamadatix 7y ago

Zen 3 is due 2020 but I personally don't think it will be a very big iteration. Zen 4 is roadmapped to follow up and will likely change the socket as well as represent a node shrink, I'd say this one has the most potential for further shake up on the design. The popular thing to talk about in the rumor mills has been if they continue to make it any wider SMT4 as seen in Power may come about. Personally I think the IO die has the best chance for improvements though, especially towards EPYC parts which have up to 8 CCXs and a crazy memory controller to interconnect.

ksec 7y ago
Zen 4 is a new socket. Which really give AMD a chance to support DDR5 along with PCI-E 5.0. Definitely agree on the IO die. Not sure what plan AMD has with IO die, currently it is on 14nm only to use up all the Wafer Agreement that had with GF, and we are not sure how long that agreement last or if it makes sense to switch the IO die to FD-SOI which is GF's forte at the moment. But like Dr Lisa Su had said, it is important to shown their clients that they stick to their roadmap and execute it to perfection. Something Intel hasn't been doing for the past 3- 4 years.