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You have to be really ignorant of the world to think that, outside its borders, the USA is a well-respected entity. It doesn't take a Russian operation to turn

You have to be really ignorant of the world to think that, outside its borders, the USA is a well-respected entity. It doesn't take a Russian operation to turn the world against American policies. All it takes, is for an informed person to pay attention to what America and its allies are actually doing around the world. A majority of the world outside of America's borders, actually do inform themselves, and guess what? What America is doing to the world is ugly. Russia doesn't need to campaign against America and convince people - America is doing enough of that itself. Those of us who have actually gotten to know refugees from Americas wars, see the truth. America is destroying sovereign states around the globe in order to serve its own special interests (its military-industrial-pharmaceutical complex). Here in Europe, Americans need to understand one thing: we're not stupid. We see what your nation is doing without needing to be told by authorities what to think about it. A significant portion of the European middle class actually ignore the propaganda and go see for themselves. We don't have the immense American media apparatus blinding us to the truth of America's wars: 500,000 innocent peoples' lives lost since Iraq, endless refugees from American wars, walking across Europe. You want evidence that America is out of control? Go talk to a refugee from one of America's wars. Can't do that? Then its your propaganda apparatus working to turn your face from the truth.

ardit33 7y ago
I am European dude and not a US citizen, so I am speaking as a third party ..... And Yes I know USA and support it (most of their actions, but not all), and so most of my country. Interesting, as I lived in Sweden as well, and they were pretty fond of USA as well, even though they are not part of NATO. Looking at your post history, it is mostly vitriol against USA. Where are you from? How come you speak in the name 'of all europeans'.
- fit2rule 7y ago
  You're speaking for 'most of your country, and "Sweden", when you lived there. Ever been to a refugee camp and spoken to Iraqi's, Syrians, Lybians, Yemeni, Afghani victims of the illegal wars being carried out by America and its allies? I live within walking distance of a refugee camp. I've spent the last few years getting to know the victims of America's illegal wars. The vitriol is warranted. Real human beings have been smashed to pieces. (Note: am Australian, have lived and worked in the USA, and am now in Austria, also a non-NATO country. Austrians inform themselves, and have done a lot for the victims of America's illegal wars. Swedes?)
dang 7y ago
We've asked you many times to stop taking HN threads further into flamewar. As I've told you repeatedly, if you can't or won't stop doing this, we're going to have to ban you. I don't want to ban you, because you've also posted good comments. But would you please fix this? HN is not for fulminating and fomenting, however justified your cause. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- fit2rule 7y ago
  Are you an American, dang? Because its very clear to me that you won't tolerate any criticism of your in-group, and that makes HN less valuable, not more.
  - dang 7y ago
    Anyone who wants to can slog through my moderation comments (not that I recommend it) and find reams of counterexamples. The reason that is "very clear to you", even though it's false, is that people notice the calls they disagree with much more strongly than the ones they like. If your loyalty were to the opposite side, the cases you like vs. dislike would be flipped, you'd notice the opposite ones more strongly, and so would perceive us as being biased the opposite way. In other words, your perception is a function of your views, not mine. For users with passionate opinions, it always feels like the mods are against them. It's just the same as passionate sports fans who feel the refs are against their team. Meanwhile the other team's fans feel the same. The main thing, though, is that this response is a non sequitur. You've been breaking the site guidelines, regardless of your view of America's wars (or whatever $issue happens to be), and we need you to follow them instead.
    - fit2rule 7y ago
      I agree with you that there is no need to be rude or offensive in these threads, and I do try not to flame individuals, but when there's a fire to be put out and we are told not to go anywhere near the fire because it bothers the people who started the fire, what's to be done? Is there a thread on HN which provides a good example for how to discuss these issues without incurring your wrath? I think this whitewashing on HN, and the constant censorship of those who would raise the alarm in the context of relevant threads ("Russian meddling" is okay to discus - "American War Crimes", not so much), is a travesty. If there is a way to discuss this without incurring your ban hammer, I'm all ears. Or is criticism of American wars, because it hurts Americans feelings, simply off limits? Perhaps its also time to discuss whether or not having a multi-national team of moderators would be a better way to redress this issue on HN. As it stands, I think you work hard and provide a valuable service, but its clear you've reached your limit when it comes time to think critically about what America is doing to the world, especially when it seems perfectly acceptable to highlight Russia's negative influence. This doesn't seem right.

ardit33 7y ago

I am European dude and not a US citizen, so I am speaking as a third party ..... And Yes I know USA and support it (most of their actions, but not all), and so most of my country. Interesting, as I lived in Sweden as well, and they were pretty fond of USA as well, even though they are not part of NATO. Looking at your post history, it is mostly vitriol against USA. Where are you from? How come you speak in the name 'of all europeans'.

fit2rule 7y ago
You're speaking for 'most of your country, and "Sweden", when you lived there. Ever been to a refugee camp and spoken to Iraqi's, Syrians, Lybians, Yemeni, Afghani victims of the illegal wars being carried out by America and its allies? I live within walking distance of a refugee camp. I've spent the last few years getting to know the victims of America's illegal wars. The vitriol is warranted. Real human beings have been smashed to pieces. (Note: am Australian, have lived and worked in the USA, and am now in Austria, also a non-NATO country. Austrians inform themselves, and have done a lot for the victims of America's illegal wars. Swedes?)

dang 7y ago

We've asked you many times to stop taking HN threads further into flamewar. As I've told you repeatedly, if you can't or won't stop doing this, we're going to have to ban you. I don't want to ban you, because you've also posted good comments. But would you please fix this? HN is not for fulminating and fomenting, however justified your cause. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

fit2rule 7y ago
Are you an American, dang? Because its very clear to me that you won't tolerate any criticism of your in-group, and that makes HN less valuable, not more.
- dang 7y ago
  Anyone who wants to can slog through my moderation comments (not that I recommend it) and find reams of counterexamples. The reason that is "very clear to you", even though it's false, is that people notice the calls they disagree with much more strongly than the ones they like. If your loyalty were to the opposite side, the cases you like vs. dislike would be flipped, you'd notice the opposite ones more strongly, and so would perceive us as being biased the opposite way. In other words, your perception is a function of your views, not mine. For users with passionate opinions, it always feels like the mods are against them. It's just the same as passionate sports fans who feel the refs are against their team. Meanwhile the other team's fans feel the same. The main thing, though, is that this response is a non sequitur. You've been breaking the site guidelines, regardless of your view of America's wars (or whatever $issue happens to be), and we need you to follow them instead.
  - fit2rule 7y ago
    I agree with you that there is no need to be rude or offensive in these threads, and I do try not to flame individuals, but when there's a fire to be put out and we are told not to go anywhere near the fire because it bothers the people who started the fire, what's to be done? Is there a thread on HN which provides a good example for how to discuss these issues without incurring your wrath? I think this whitewashing on HN, and the constant censorship of those who would raise the alarm in the context of relevant threads ("Russian meddling" is okay to discus - "American War Crimes", not so much), is a travesty. If there is a way to discuss this without incurring your ban hammer, I'm all ears. Or is criticism of American wars, because it hurts Americans feelings, simply off limits? Perhaps its also time to discuss whether or not having a multi-national team of moderators would be a better way to redress this issue on HN. As it stands, I think you work hard and provide a valuable service, but its clear you've reached your limit when it comes time to think critically about what America is doing to the world, especially when it seems perfectly acceptable to highlight Russia's negative influence. This doesn't seem right.