4 ms·

Both the USA and UK provide legal aid for poor people even if the procedures are different. If you cannot afford a solicitor, the government will help you pay

by throw20102010 7y ago

Both the USA and UK provide legal aid for poor people even if the procedures are different. If you cannot afford a solicitor, the government will help you pay for one, but they probably won't be the best. In both countries rich people get better legal representation than poor people. Don't make the UK out to be some paradise (legal or otherwise), it struggles with plenty of its own problems.

jdietrich 7y ago
The UK doesn't have cash bail, so nobody is stuck in pre-trial detention simply because they can't afford to buy their freedom. It doesn't have elected prosecutors, judges or sheriffs. It incarcerates less than a quarter as many people per capita. It doesn't have three-strike laws and uses mandatory minimum sentences only for an extremely limited number of serious offences. The UK is far from perfect, but most of the criticisms of the American criminal justice system simply don't apply.
- merpnderp 7y ago
  Aren’t people far more likely to be a victim of crime in the UK?
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - ska 7y ago
    It doesn't seem to be true (some silly news articles notwithstanding) but these things are surprisingly difficult to compare properly.
  - jdietrich 7y ago
    It's very difficult to compare like-for-like, because we have different laws and compile crime statistics differently. The intentional homicide rate is substantially lower in the UK (1.2 vs 5.35 per 100,000), as is our rate of killings by law enforcement (0.2 vs 30.4 per 10,000,000). The UK may have slightly more property crime (12.2% vs 10% of population victimised), but it's not clear if that comparison is statistically valid. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intention... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_killings_by_law_enforcement_officers_by_countries https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_killings_by_law_enforc... https://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Crime/Property-crime-victims https://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Crime/Proper...
  - dazc 7y ago
    From petty crime, I suspect, yes. Why, because even when criminals are convicted they spend very short periods of time in prison (if at all). And, on release, they have much less chance of integrating into normal society than previously and fall into a pattern of reoffending, going to prison, reoffending, and so on. In the UK, it seems, almost everyone has a tale about when they were burgled, when they were mugged or when their car was broken into. Is this so in other countries, I think not?
    - mantap 7y ago
      I have never been burgled, mugged or had my car broken into. The only crime that I worry about on a regular basis is pickpocketing but this is similar to other European countries.
  - lostjohnny 7y ago
    It depends on what you mean by people. Are you a WASP? I guess you're safe in US. Are you black, latin american, native american, foreigner? I'm quite sure you are safer outside of the US.
- hdfbdtbcdg 7y ago
  We have at least recently ended the appalling practice of non-time-limited police bail. It still takes 2-3 years to get to trial for serious offences during which time your name and face are plastered all over the papers (at least locally). Mounting a successful defence can cost 10s to 100s of thousands of pounds. Fighting off charges of which you are innocent is not fun. If we assume that the UK's system is good enough to just increase the arrest rate and it will all come out in the wash this would destroy many people's lives.

jdietrich 7y ago

The UK doesn't have cash bail, so nobody is stuck in pre-trial detention simply because they can't afford to buy their freedom. It doesn't have elected prosecutors, judges or sheriffs. It incarcerates less than a quarter as many people per capita. It doesn't have three-strike laws and uses mandatory minimum sentences only for an extremely limited number of serious offences. The UK is far from perfect, but most of the criticisms of the American criminal justice system simply don't apply.

merpnderp 7y ago
Aren’t people far more likely to be a victim of crime in the UK?
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- ska 7y ago
  It doesn't seem to be true (some silly news articles notwithstanding) but these things are surprisingly difficult to compare properly.
- jdietrich 7y ago
  It's very difficult to compare like-for-like, because we have different laws and compile crime statistics differently. The intentional homicide rate is substantially lower in the UK (1.2 vs 5.35 per 100,000), as is our rate of killings by law enforcement (0.2 vs 30.4 per 10,000,000). The UK may have slightly more property crime (12.2% vs 10% of population victimised), but it's not clear if that comparison is statistically valid. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intention... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_killings_by_law_enforcement_officers_by_countries https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_killings_by_law_enforc... https://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Crime/Property-crime-victims https://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/Crime/Proper...
- dazc 7y ago
  From petty crime, I suspect, yes. Why, because even when criminals are convicted they spend very short periods of time in prison (if at all). And, on release, they have much less chance of integrating into normal society than previously and fall into a pattern of reoffending, going to prison, reoffending, and so on. In the UK, it seems, almost everyone has a tale about when they were burgled, when they were mugged or when their car was broken into. Is this so in other countries, I think not?
  - mantap 7y ago
    I have never been burgled, mugged or had my car broken into. The only crime that I worry about on a regular basis is pickpocketing but this is similar to other European countries.
- lostjohnny 7y ago
  It depends on what you mean by people. Are you a WASP? I guess you're safe in US. Are you black, latin american, native american, foreigner? I'm quite sure you are safer outside of the US.
hdfbdtbcdg 7y ago
We have at least recently ended the appalling practice of non-time-limited police bail. It still takes 2-3 years to get to trial for serious offences during which time your name and face are plastered all over the papers (at least locally). Mounting a successful defence can cost 10s to 100s of thousands of pounds. Fighting off charges of which you are innocent is not fun. If we assume that the UK's system is good enough to just increase the arrest rate and it will all come out in the wash this would destroy many people's lives.