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Ice cream truck makes Instagram 'stars' pay double
- mcv 7y agoI just realised that these 'influencers' sound a lot like professional beggars. They're successful at something, right? There's no need for them to beg like that, and they're presenting it as if they're doing you a favour while they do it.
- oblio 7y agoThere is a certain irony related to the "Support the Guardian" bit at the end of the article.
- ptah 7y agoThey are peculiar as they are owned by a trust, not a corporation so not profit driven
- coldtea 7y agoAre the journalists working there "profit driven"? Do they work for a salary, often lucrative, or do they write for free?
- mcv 7y agoAnd do they put in actual work and need to pay for food and rent?
- coldtea 7y agoWhat's "actual work"? How is writing more "actual" than shooting videos and doing photo shoots (which can be lots of hard work out in the field every day)? Influencers have built an audience, and are paid for ads and promotional deals. This sounds like professional work to me, especially since some are making 6+ figures. And of course they also need to pay for "food and rent". If it was about "actual" work, then those journalists in need of "support" could go do a job that actually pays, in a non declining industry.
- throwaway8879 7y agoI like your question about actual work. I suppose anything that helps pay the bills should count. So I definitely agree that bring a social media influencer should count as real or actual work. It's just that there's a "bad taste" element to the profession, similar to how people may react to selling MLM beauty products or Herbalife. I suppose Herbalife should count as actual work too, at least to the people who get sucked into selling the products. But I also see why restaurants/hotels and food vendors might react negatively to influencers who try to get free service in exchange for exposure that may or may not exist.
- mcv 7y agoI find this rather sad, as good journalism is vital for a healthy, free democracy. And yet we don't seem to have a good way to pay for it. In a capitalist system, entertainment is more profitable than news.
- coldtea 7y agoOn the other hand journalism has also been a weapon for controlling mass opinion, propaganda, and promoting particular interests, from the days of Hearst at least, to the WMD and all kinds of more subtle manipulation. I'd rather have a vibrant scene like the blogging of yore, with good voices rising to the top (or not), than large press interests and gatekeepers.
- t0astbread 7y agoBut blogs and entertainment can also be used as propaganda?
- coldtea 7y agoSure. But tv/press had an unfair advantage of being a gatekeeper, not offering a way for the public to respond (except for "letters to the editor" and such), having unique access to power figures, and so on. Blogs did away with most of that.
- 7y ago
- jpmoral 7y agoYou're conflating profit motive and working for money.
- C1sc0cat 7y agoMost Journalists salaries are a pittance.
- coldtea 7y agoCompared to programmers, maybe. Still much better than most available middle class gigs, and the "sky is the limit" once they have connections to power and influence.
- C1sc0cat 7y agoNot as much as you would think - I recall an ex Journalist who went into PR telling me that the deputy editor of the Scotsman was receiving income support (the benefit that toped up your income if you had a low family income)
- C1sc0cat 7y agoThe Guardian Might Not be but GMG is and the new editor is trying improved the Guardians Finances so it breaks even.
- benj111 7y agoIrony like the Alanis Morrisette song? (ie not ironic at all). The Guardian are asking the readership to support the articles, you'll note they paid for their own icecream.'Influencers' are asking the subjects to fund the articles. One is advertising, one is journalism. I'll backtrack slightly on that last sentence, advertising/sponsorship can work for certain things, in general though its a big conflict of interest.
- mcv 7y agoNo need to backtrack. If the person/company/brand you're writing about is also the one paying you to write about them, that is exactly advertising. It's not news.
- benj111 7y agoI backtracked because of all the possible exceptions. If a gaming magazine reviews a game they didn't pay for, or what about car reviewers buying cars they didn't pay for. These are generally referred to as journalism. Then there's sponsorship, what if 'green' company sponsors green content, or a vegan company sponsors an article about the bad things about industrial meat production. So I not sure its completely black and white.
- ptah 7y agokind of like "come and play guitar at my bar without pay for the exposure"
- coldtea 7y agoOnly in this case, it actually works, as there are firms (even international brands) paying influencers top dollars for mentioning their products. So more like "come play at Max's Kansas City without pay for the exposure" -- tons of bands would have jumped at the chance. It's just that not all influencers have equal reach (and not all businesses need the extra promotion. Nike can always sell more shoes, but an ice cream stand might have to push people away if they have too many customers, as there's so many a person can serve).
- hjk05 7y agoActually it’s the other way around. “If you let me, I’ll play at your bar for free beer”. The influencers are selling advertisement for cheap. And it’s the same deal as with musicians, it’s a good deal which is mutually beneficiary if the talent is there, if not, we’ll then you laugh at the offer and try to publicly humiliate the person trying to establish a place for themselves. “Can you believe this guy wanted to play at my bar, AND expected free beer? What a joke”.
- jacobush 7y agoWhen you have a bunch every day, who can barely hold the guitar or sing a tune, posing like they are Led Zeppelin if they can just have a free beer... yeah I might snap too after a while.
- robjan 7y agoAre the advertisements cheap though? Half of the influencers who have approached my businesses have obviously paid for most of their followers and their "advert" would be unlikely to result in any conversions.
- traderjane 7y agoThat’s on the business to judge of course, as are all deals. Isn’t it on the business to model marketing effectiveness?
- coldtea 7y ago>They're successful at something, right? There's no need for them to beg like that, and they're presenting it as if they're doing you a favour while they do it. Isn't that the very thing they're successful at? Getting deals and stuff for free in exchange of their pretty little faces promoting it to their fans.
- thecatspaw 7y agoYes, and if they are good enough, they result in a net gain for the other party as well.
- mnky9800n 7y agothey are the instagram version of those backpackers with shitty cardboard signs begging for money so they can keep up their "spiritual journey across different cultures" or whatever nonsense they claim to pursue.
- me_me_me 7y agoNo they are not, 'backpackers' wants to go on a journey and will thank you for your money. They don't promises nor demand anything from you.
- tedmiston 7y agoIf they are successful, then their posts are worth more than $4 so they wouldn't be eager to trade one for an ice cream cone.
- bradleyjg 7y agoI don't think it's quite the same. The influencers are at least purporting to offer a trade value for value. Maybe they aren't actually offering value, maybe some of them are even knowingly not providing value, but that's fraud not begging. A beggar says give me something because I want it without even a pretense of offering anything in exchange.
- urbanjunkie 7y agofuck influencers, right in their vapid little faces
- Theodores 7y agoIt is quite easy to bash the influencers. They are a popular target. There is another story in the news today about influencers wanting to get free wedding pictures. I am waiting for a 'before they were famous' expose from someone who does make it to get the millions of subscribers. At that level of the game it works differently, everything comes for free and stuff has to be turned down. But these people were struggling once, they once had zero subscribers/followers and nothing they could say would be received well by anyone. They must have 'couldn't even get an ice cream' stories. Fun that it is to deride the influencer, there are options for more constructive approaches. The ice cream truck could offer just the one ice cream to an influencer a week, with an online application form and many other administrative hoops and hurdles. Then the free ice cream could go to whomever has the most followers. Then, when awkwardly asked at the van, he could just politely show them the form. If they win the competition (of who has the most followers) and can come back a week later then sure they can have their free ice cream. That is fair enough, surely?
- Nextgrid 7y ago> I am waiting for a 'before they were famous' expose from someone who does make it to get the millions of subscribers. Before they were famous? Broke college students probably or something like that. Frankly a more respectable career than begging and peddling shit on social networks. > Fun that it is to deride the influencer, there are options for more constructive approaches. But why should the food truck operator care? He didn’t ask for anything and still gets solicited by these beggars (they call it a “business” but I’d argue if your business can’t buy you a $4 ice cream then something is horribly wrong). It can also be offensive, just like when artists are asked to perform for “exposure”.
- wolco 7y agoRespectable? If hollywood accepts it and starts including it in popular shows/movies the respectibility level will raise. You see local news personalities/sports stars all in tv/print ads. They are trading on the respectability of their primary career you would think they suffer from a drop respectability but it increases.
- 7y ago
- Cthulhu_ 7y agoAnother solution I've read in another related post was to just make them a counter-offer - they'll get the cost of the ice cream back if their "influencing" sells him ten more ice creams.
- mothsonasloth 7y agoThese Instagram influencers remind me of the South Park episode about Yelp reviewers.
- WalterBright 7y agoIn open source land, we give it away free to everyone!
- UweSchmidt 7y agoSocial media and 'influencers' are not going away. Instead of being critical and dismissive I would rather try and accept this fundamental change in human interaction. It is another step from collectivism where everyone is paying for their own icecream to the next level of individualism. Humanity will have a lot more 'influencers' or 'stars' who stand out and have incredible influence. This can be entertainers who have a billion followers, or software developers who make a living as speakers and 'evangelists', but can also mean political influence: The last elections in Germany were massively impacted by a polarizing video from a blue haired Youtuber - why shouldn't that guy run for office himself next time? There are still many institutions and gatekeepers due for disruption. This is economically fueled by advertising. Firstly, using influencers to present a product is fundamentally stronger than classic advertising. Secondly, it's cheaper for the advertiser, while the influencer just needs a few thousands/month to quit their job.
- SwiftyBug 7y ago> The last elections in Germany were massively impacted by a polarizing video from a blue haired Youtuber - why shouldn't that guy run for office himself next time? This happened in Brazil. Kim Kataguiri[1] gained visibilty as a YouTuber and is now a congressman. [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Kataguiri https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Kataguiri
- t0astbread 7y agoNot every "influencer" is the same. Some have actual skills and adequate reach to justify advertising via them (I believe this is what you labeled "influencer" in your comment) while others are just trying to get freebies without contributing any value back to the client. Additionally, regarding politics: While I do believe that empowering people who are actually concerned with the well-being of their community is important and an area in which our political systems could improve, I also think that "disrupting" politics by giving power to influencers would ultimately lead to more bad than good (in the form of indoctrination, corruption and populism).
- UweSchmidt 7y ago
- miyuru 7y agoreddit post that went viral: https://old.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/c7tzig/los_angeles_ice_cream_truck_owner_is_tired_of/?sort=top https://old.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/c7tzig/los_angeles_ic...
- johnnycab 7y agoThe article makes it quite clear that the seller chose the direct approach rather than wasting his time negotiating with someone, who did not have any leverage or provide any added value for his business. There is a variation of a proverb that was used as a sign and was ubiquitous in bars, pubs, tradesmen, shops et al., which stated: 'Don't ask for credit, as a smack in the mouth often hurts[offends]'. This worked like a charm to ward off any would-be chancers and freeloaders; the ice cream man's version is more modern and less vague. It also comes across, that he rather enjoyed his meta role of becoming an 'anti-influencer' and then using that influence to get the traditional media involved, thus influencing the silent majority to get behind his message, with bonus points for boosting his business without compromising on his ideals.
- officemonkey 7y agoTBH, if you're a real influencer, you're not going to trade a mention for a free $4 ice cream cone.
- doitLP 7y agoA couple weeks ago I stood in line right behind a group of “influencers” trying to get their meal for free at a new restaurant. They succeeded after a 20 minute delay for the entire line (that went out the door) while the manager was fetched and tried to decide what to do. It was quite rude of the influencers but I wondered that the business would make the whole line wait for the sake of these people of questionable value. Btw this was a new location of a very popular chain; they weren’t struggling for promotion. I walk by the CVT ice cream truck in the article about once a week. Maybe my same influencers tried him as well. I hope so.
- mavsman 7y agoA little ironic that they use the end of this article to plug an author who is supposedly an expert on influencers and claims, "no real influencer would ask for a four-dollar ice cream."
- jl2718 7y agoSeems to me that an Instagram influencer post is now a negative indicator of quality.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]