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"I’ll probably get downvoted for this, but a strong argument can be made that the European welfare state has only been made possible due to massive US defense s

"I’ll probably get downvoted for this, but a strong argument can be made that the European welfare state has only been made possible due to massive US defense subsidies and economic stimulus during the post WWII/Cold War. " As a German that's actually something I agree about with Trump. Europe lets the Americans often do the dirty work for them (an example would be Yugoslavia in the 90s where nothing happened until the Americans started doing something). Europe should be paying more for its own defense. But that shouldn't be an excuse for a lot of dysfunctional policies in the US. The health care system is expensive and bad. Mass incarceration is very expensive and disenfranchises large population groups. A lot of low income workers are being exploited without recourse. I also question if the US really needs to spend as much on military as it does.

hangonhn 7y ago
I have the same sentiment but that was more or less part of the US strategy for maintaining peace in the world during the Cold War. As someone once said the purpose of NATO is to "keep in the US in, the Russians out, and the Germans down". It's a bit unfair to the Germans to blame both wars on them but the strategy of extending American protection over the Western European powers means they won't have to be too heavily armed as long as there is guarantee that the US can come rescue them in case of an invasion. I think the system stayed in place after the war and without a threat of invasion, why wouldn't the Germans and other Western allies dial down the defense budget even more?
- Ididntdothis 7y ago
  " I think the system stayed in place after the war and without a threat of invasion, why wouldn't the Germans and other Western allies dial down the defense budget even more?" I think it's time for Europe to grow up and stand on their own feet.
  - natechols 7y ago
    I don't necessarily disagree with this, but I can understand why Germany would be reluctant to significantly expand its military, and I can understand even better why the entire rest of Europe (especially, but not only, Russia) would prefer to have Germany protected by American nukes and not German nukes.

hangonhn 7y ago

I have the same sentiment but that was more or less part of the US strategy for maintaining peace in the world during the Cold War. As someone once said the purpose of NATO is to "keep in the US in, the Russians out, and the Germans down". It's a bit unfair to the Germans to blame both wars on them but the strategy of extending American protection over the Western European powers means they won't have to be too heavily armed as long as there is guarantee that the US can come rescue them in case of an invasion. I think the system stayed in place after the war and without a threat of invasion, why wouldn't the Germans and other Western allies dial down the defense budget even more?

Ididntdothis 7y ago
" I think the system stayed in place after the war and without a threat of invasion, why wouldn't the Germans and other Western allies dial down the defense budget even more?" I think it's time for Europe to grow up and stand on their own feet.
- natechols 7y ago
  I don't necessarily disagree with this, but I can understand why Germany would be reluctant to significantly expand its military, and I can understand even better why the entire rest of Europe (especially, but not only, Russia) would prefer to have Germany protected by American nukes and not German nukes.