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Amazing. The Tesla haters were going to town on them all quarter, claiming bankruptcy was imminent and there was "no demand". Now they've delivered more cars t

Amazing. The Tesla haters were going to town on them all quarter, claiming bankruptcy was imminent and there was "no demand". Now they've delivered more cars than any other quarter in their history.

DevKoala 7y ago
What's amazing is the power of their message. There is just too much money to gain by Tesla competitors and investors who bet against Tesla. All the negative headlines going into this quarter results had little to no substance, but were louder than ever.
- dralley 7y ago
  I'd hardly say 3 VPs leaving in a week says nothing of substance whatsoever.
  - sixQuarks 7y ago
    what's new about this? They'v always had high levels of turnover. Their head of production left right as model 3 was in the midst of production hell.
    - threeseed 7y ago
      Have we seen 3 VPs leave in such rapid succession especially after what was supposedly an amazing quarter ? Tesla isn't some startup any more. They've been around long enough to not warrant this level of chaos.
      - HeadsUpHigh 7y ago
        Eeeeeh there's always something new. At this point unless it's legal trouble I don't pay attention to any negative article about Tesla -or any article in general-. I just look at the quarter numbers.
        new_realist 7y ago
        Will you be looking at Q2 and Q3 earnings?
        HeadsUpHigh 7y ago
        Yes every quarter I take a peek.
        sixQuarks 7y ago
        exactly.
  - sunstone 7y ago
    It's clear now that an avalanche of electric vehicles are on the way. These VP's are in very high demand, not unlike star athletes on the championship team. They are leaving now because they know that with this quarter most of the major issues (other than battery supply) have been taken care of. Counter intuitively, perhaps, it's a good sign for Tesla. Next man up.
  - dmode 7y ago
    People routinely change jobs in the Valley. I bet if you look closely 3 exec would have left Google / Apple / FB this week as well.
  - DevKoala 7y ago
    Before any VP left, the negativity train was on full steam. In fact, the delivery numbers are the focus because all estimates predicted Tesla was going to miss them. Check this for example. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-tesla-deliveries/tesla-faces-delivery-bottleneck-at-close-of-second-quarter-electrek-idUSKCN1TQ2NW https://www.reuters.com/article/us-tesla-deliveries/tesla-fa... or this: https://qz.com/1590939/teslas-first-quarter-auto-deliveries-miss-is-worrying-analysts/ https://qz.com/1590939/teslas-first-quarter-auto-deliveries-...
  - omarforgotpwd 7y ago
    They have lots of turn over. Common in tech and with low jobless rate, and it's an extremely demanding job. Other auto companies are getting rid of their CEO
- 3327 7y ago
  Good point - it shows that those betting against tesla on the short side have some SERIOUS connections and clout. So who are they? Koch money and texan hedge funds maybe, who knows. It would be interesting to see when the 13F comes out.
threeseed 7y ago
Of course they delivered more cars. The Model 3 is substantially cheaper than the S/X models which means you get more volume with lower margins. And we are seeing quarter by quarter a drop in the ARPU as the S/X models are being cannibalised by the Model 3. It's amazing that Musk has twisted the narrative to be all about deliveries instead of profitability. But ultimately unless they can dramatically reign in costs it will be their downfall.
- new_realist 7y ago
  With their deep discounts this quarter, Tesla is selling a dollar for ninety cents and will suffer massive losses. US Model 3 demand peaked in 2018, and Europe is down in Q2 (especially considering the two month sales window in Q1).
- woodandsteel 7y ago
  If you are a typical Tesla hater then you have been making mistaken predictions every quarter for the last ten years.
  - favorited 7y ago
    s/a typical Tesla hater/Elon Musk/g
  - threeseed 7y ago
    I like how any criticism what so ever of Tesla/Musk results in comments like this. How about addressing my points. Specifically focusing on profitability and their declining ARPU.
- zaroth 7y ago
  Of course they delivered more cars! Probably because TM3 is light years ahead of anything else on the market, EV or otherwise. One thing I love about Tesla is their plan was always all about the Model 3 (and eventually Y). They didn’t relegate their best technology into S/X and hobble the 3. They put everything they had into TM3 to make it the pinnacle of what they could accomplish and as forward thinking as possible. It’s an absolute generational leap which I think will sell very strongly for a decade. All the while they will continue to work on cost efficiency, margins, and scale, while delivering a constant stream of software and hardware updates to the growing fleet. The next big refresh of S/X will drive them forward with their newest battery tech, powered by their Maxwell acquisition, and motor, suspension, and most notably I would assume materials improvements which will re-differentiate S/X from the 3 and pull more buyers up to that level. But TM3P is just so incredibly compelling I’m not at all surprised a Tesla buyers at the $60k+ price point would go with that over the S. I think we will see in Q3/Q4 that Tesla does not need a $60k ASP in order to be profitable. Part of that of course will be buoyed by credits and rebates which is an important part of their overall strategy. Legacy carmakers will pay Tesla billions to cover their ICE pollution cost.
elihu 7y ago
I expect some of the orders were people wanting to get their car before the federal tax credit phased out entirely. (I thought about it, but couldn't convince myself to buy a very expensive car with no access to service manuals.) Hopefully they can keep selling cars as fast as they can make them even without the credit.
- zaroth 7y ago
  It halved again (-$1875) where it will stay for another 6 months.
- Phase_White 7y ago
  FYI on the service manuals. The service manuals are out there on the internet if you look.
new_realist 7y ago
It’s very likely Tesla lost money in Q2 whist pushing Elon’s sales narrative. I expect retained earnings to soon exceed -$7B and another capital raise in 2020. Demand in existing markets, like the US and Europe, is down from 2018 and sales are being driven by heavy discounts this quarter, including the SR+.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- taway3324 7y ago
  I normally try to stay out of Tesla discussions on HN, and I've had more than one get quite toxic in the past so I'm writing this from a throwaway, but in what world is demand down from 2018 for tesla? According to this release, they still have more orders than deliveries which means they are still taking more orders than they can produce and deliver right now, this quarter had a record setting number of deliveries for the company, and i'm not sure what other markets they are currently delivering to in huge numbers other than the US and Europe (The UK just recently started getting deliveries, and I doubt a large portion of Q2's deliveries was from the UK, but I fully admit I could be way off base there). There also aren't really any "discounts" they are offering, especially not on the SR+. I just helped a friend go through the process of picking one out, and he waited until near the end of the quarter hoping there would be discounts, but there weren't any, even for the few inventory cars that were available (Tesla's website shows literally 0 inventory cars within 200 miles of me in Florida right now...) In fact over the course of Q2 they INCREASED the price of the Model 3 (SR+ included) by at least $400 in the US. I can't speak to their financials at all, for all I know Tesla is losing money at crazy speeds, but demand seems to be there just fine, still over what they can produce, and they sure as hell aren't discounting any car that my friend or I was able to buy. If you answer nothing else, please at least answer where you got the idea that they are heavily discounting anything at the company, ESPECIALLY the SR+ Model 3? Because that seems almost entirely made up and 100% against literally everything I can see myself. Unless you are somehow counting the lower price of their "refresh" Model X and S that they announced march 1st, which seems to be literally the only time prices have gone down for their lineup over the past quarter.
- 7y ago

Amazing. The Tesla haters were going to town on them all quarter, claiming bankruptcy was imminent and there was "no demand". Now they've delivered more cars than any other quarter in their history.

DevKoala 7y ago

What's amazing is the power of their message. There is just too much money to gain by Tesla competitors and investors who bet against Tesla. All the negative headlines going into this quarter results had little to no substance, but were louder than ever.

dralley 7y ago
I'd hardly say 3 VPs leaving in a week says nothing of substance whatsoever.
- sixQuarks 7y ago
  what's new about this? They'v always had high levels of turnover. Their head of production left right as model 3 was in the midst of production hell.
  - threeseed 7y ago
    Have we seen 3 VPs leave in such rapid succession especially after what was supposedly an amazing quarter ? Tesla isn't some startup any more. They've been around long enough to not warrant this level of chaos.
    - HeadsUpHigh 7y ago
      Eeeeeh there's always something new. At this point unless it's legal trouble I don't pay attention to any negative article about Tesla -or any article in general-. I just look at the quarter numbers.
      - new_realist 7y ago
        Will you be looking at Q2 and Q3 earnings?
        HeadsUpHigh 7y ago
        Yes every quarter I take a peek.
      - sixQuarks 7y ago
        exactly.
- sunstone 7y ago
  It's clear now that an avalanche of electric vehicles are on the way. These VP's are in very high demand, not unlike star athletes on the championship team. They are leaving now because they know that with this quarter most of the major issues (other than battery supply) have been taken care of. Counter intuitively, perhaps, it's a good sign for Tesla. Next man up.
- dmode 7y ago
  People routinely change jobs in the Valley. I bet if you look closely 3 exec would have left Google / Apple / FB this week as well.
- DevKoala 7y ago
  Before any VP left, the negativity train was on full steam. In fact, the delivery numbers are the focus because all estimates predicted Tesla was going to miss them. Check this for example. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-tesla-deliveries/tesla-faces-delivery-bottleneck-at-close-of-second-quarter-electrek-idUSKCN1TQ2NW https://www.reuters.com/article/us-tesla-deliveries/tesla-fa... or this: https://qz.com/1590939/teslas-first-quarter-auto-deliveries-miss-is-worrying-analysts/ https://qz.com/1590939/teslas-first-quarter-auto-deliveries-...
- omarforgotpwd 7y ago
  They have lots of turn over. Common in tech and with low jobless rate, and it's an extremely demanding job. Other auto companies are getting rid of their CEO
3327 7y ago
Good point - it shows that those betting against tesla on the short side have some SERIOUS connections and clout. So who are they? Koch money and texan hedge funds maybe, who knows. It would be interesting to see when the 13F comes out.

threeseed 7y ago

Of course they delivered more cars. The Model 3 is substantially cheaper than the S/X models which means you get more volume with lower margins. And we are seeing quarter by quarter a drop in the ARPU as the S/X models are being cannibalised by the Model 3. It's amazing that Musk has twisted the narrative to be all about deliveries instead of profitability. But ultimately unless they can dramatically reign in costs it will be their downfall.

new_realist 7y ago
With their deep discounts this quarter, Tesla is selling a dollar for ninety cents and will suffer massive losses. US Model 3 demand peaked in 2018, and Europe is down in Q2 (especially considering the two month sales window in Q1).
woodandsteel 7y ago
If you are a typical Tesla hater then you have been making mistaken predictions every quarter for the last ten years.
- favorited 7y ago
  s/a typical Tesla hater/Elon Musk/g
- threeseed 7y ago
  I like how any criticism what so ever of Tesla/Musk results in comments like this. How about addressing my points. Specifically focusing on profitability and their declining ARPU.
zaroth 7y ago
Of course they delivered more cars! Probably because TM3 is light years ahead of anything else on the market, EV or otherwise. One thing I love about Tesla is their plan was always all about the Model 3 (and eventually Y). They didn’t relegate their best technology into S/X and hobble the 3. They put everything they had into TM3 to make it the pinnacle of what they could accomplish and as forward thinking as possible. It’s an absolute generational leap which I think will sell very strongly for a decade. All the while they will continue to work on cost efficiency, margins, and scale, while delivering a constant stream of software and hardware updates to the growing fleet. The next big refresh of S/X will drive them forward with their newest battery tech, powered by their Maxwell acquisition, and motor, suspension, and most notably I would assume materials improvements which will re-differentiate S/X from the 3 and pull more buyers up to that level. But TM3P is just so incredibly compelling I’m not at all surprised a Tesla buyers at the $60k+ price point would go with that over the S. I think we will see in Q3/Q4 that Tesla does not need a $60k ASP in order to be profitable. Part of that of course will be buoyed by credits and rebates which is an important part of their overall strategy. Legacy carmakers will pay Tesla billions to cover their ICE pollution cost.

elihu 7y ago

I expect some of the orders were people wanting to get their car before the federal tax credit phased out entirely. (I thought about it, but couldn't convince myself to buy a very expensive car with no access to service manuals.) Hopefully they can keep selling cars as fast as they can make them even without the credit.

zaroth 7y ago
It halved again (-$1875) where it will stay for another 6 months.
Phase_White 7y ago
FYI on the service manuals. The service manuals are out there on the internet if you look.

new_realist 7y ago

It’s very likely Tesla lost money in Q2 whist pushing Elon’s sales narrative. I expect retained earnings to soon exceed -$7B and another capital raise in 2020. Demand in existing markets, like the US and Europe, is down from 2018 and sales are being driven by heavy discounts this quarter, including the SR+.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
taway3324 7y ago
I normally try to stay out of Tesla discussions on HN, and I've had more than one get quite toxic in the past so I'm writing this from a throwaway, but in what world is demand down from 2018 for tesla? According to this release, they still have more orders than deliveries which means they are still taking more orders than they can produce and deliver right now, this quarter had a record setting number of deliveries for the company, and i'm not sure what other markets they are currently delivering to in huge numbers other than the US and Europe (The UK just recently started getting deliveries, and I doubt a large portion of Q2's deliveries was from the UK, but I fully admit I could be way off base there). There also aren't really any "discounts" they are offering, especially not on the SR+. I just helped a friend go through the process of picking one out, and he waited until near the end of the quarter hoping there would be discounts, but there weren't any, even for the few inventory cars that were available (Tesla's website shows literally 0 inventory cars within 200 miles of me in Florida right now...) In fact over the course of Q2 they INCREASED the price of the Model 3 (SR+ included) by at least $400 in the US. I can't speak to their financials at all, for all I know Tesla is losing money at crazy speeds, but demand seems to be there just fine, still over what they can produce, and they sure as hell aren't discounting any car that my friend or I was able to buy. If you answer nothing else, please at least answer where you got the idea that they are heavily discounting anything at the company, ESPECIALLY the SR+ Model 3? Because that seems almost entirely made up and 100% against literally everything I can see myself. Unless you are somehow counting the lower price of their "refresh" Model X and S that they announced march 1st, which seems to be literally the only time prices have gone down for their lineup over the past quarter.
7y ago