5 ms·

Objectively is a hard claim when it comes to an integration of software and hardware. What is the integration of hardware and software worth to any particular p

by lawik 7y ago

Objectively is a hard claim when it comes to an integration of software and hardware. What is the integration of hardware and software worth to any particular person? What is Apple doubling down on privacy worth to another one? Current MBP hardware is nothing exciting to me. But my previous MBP was lasted me 2009 to 2016 I believe, with a few upgrades. And I like the OS. I don't mind working in Linux or Windows but I prefer a lot of things about the Mac. A lot of conveniences, and things that I feel have better execution. Rather predictably decent performance and good integration between software and hardware. That sort of thing. I was OK with USB-C as it matches my Android phone and the iPad Pro. I'm down to a single charger for travel. It has drawbacks but makes a bit of sense. Not a fan of the new keyboards, really don't like the Touchbar. But overall I'm still fairly happy. So that's why I, personally, bother. I care about whether they improve it because in spite of the Mac as a platform not hitting the sweets sports as well as previously for me it is still worth the premium they charge. To me. I consider Macs expensive, I'm not sure that I consider them overpriced. Under-featured I'd dismiss out of hand, I'm sure they could be to some but it really depends on what you are looking at.

jimmaswell 7y ago
Here's the current MBP priced around $1300. https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-mac/macbook-pro/13-inch-space-gray-2.3ghz-dual-core-processor-with-turbo-boost-up-to-3.6ghz-128gb https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-mac/macbook-pro/13-inch-space... Here's the laptop I bought in September 2017 for about $1200 or $1100, now down to $840. https://www.walmart.com/ip/HP-Omen-15-ax250wm-15-6-Full-HD-IPS-Display-Core-i7-7700HQ-QC-Processor-NVIDIA-GTX-1050Ti-4GB-Graphics-Card-12GB-Memory-1TB-Hard-Drive/630174927 https://www.walmart.com/ip/HP-Omen-15-ax250wm-15-6-Full-HD-I... Screen: 13" vs 15.6" RAM: 8GB vs 12GB CPU: i5 vs i7 Intel Iris Plus Graphics 640 vs GTX 1050Ti 4GB 128GB SSD vs 1TB HDD, you can buy your own 1TB SSD for around $150, far from the $800 upcharge Apple wants to charge you for that option And mine doesn't need dongles to do basic tasks like plug in a mouse or ethernet cable or monitor. I've used Mac OS for a week at a time and it really seemed like nothing special. So $500 less and I get a bigger screen, more RAM, better CPU, much better GPU, much better disk space, actual USB/HDMI/ethernet ports, with no tangible downsides unless for some reason you literally cannot just get used to using Windows 10, which is a perfectly fine OS. Plus being able to run basically whatever games I want. Edit: And I just noticed the MBP doesn't even have a numpad. Another dealbreaker for me.
- foldr 7y ago
  Doesn't the model you link to have a non-retina display? It's hardly comparable. You're not paying for raw specs when you buy a mac. You're paying for the screen, the trackpad, the aesthetics, the thin profile, the battery life, the speakers and microphone, and the OS. Apple has the good taste not to max out the specs if it means sacrificing other, more important features. If you look for Windows laptops that check all the aforementioned boxes (leaving aside the trackpad, as none of them have good trackpads), you'll be paying just as much as you pay for a macbook.
  - jimmaswell 7y ago
    Ok, here's something 4K with same or better other specs compared to mine, at $1000. https://www.amazon.com/VivoBook-Touchscreen-i7-7700HQ-GeForce-Essentials/dp/B077X9D48G https://www.amazon.com/VivoBook-Touchscreen-i7-7700HQ-GeForc... I've used the trackpad and looked at the screens of MBPs and it was nothing special. Didn't even realize the resolution was more than normal 1080p at the time. Battery life/speakers/microphone/trackpad are fine on mine. I don't see how you could think aesthetics are important enough to skimp out on power.
    - foldr 7y ago
      You can get a macbook air for not much more than $1000, with all the advantages that I mentioned. The ASUS laptop you link to has a poor battery life. You can't seriously claim that the macbook trackpads are not ahead of the competition. >Didn't even realize the resolution was more than normal 1080p at the time. Ok, but macbooks are targeted at the majority of people who can easily tell the difference.
      - jimmaswell 7y ago
        I'm sure I could tell it was over 1080p if I was paying close attention. It's mostly just passing familiarity being around coworker computers. Maybe Macbook trackpads really are that great but I have no complaints about mine. And I'm sure the battery life is fine if you turn on power saving features and don't leave intensive stuff running.

by lawik 7y ago

jimmaswell 7y ago

Here's the current MBP priced around $1300. https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-mac/macbook-pro/13-inch-space-gray-2.3ghz-dual-core-processor-with-turbo-boost-up-to-3.6ghz-128gb https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-mac/macbook-pro/13-inch-space... Here's the laptop I bought in September 2017 for about $1200 or $1100, now down to $840. https://www.walmart.com/ip/HP-Omen-15-ax250wm-15-6-Full-HD-IPS-Display-Core-i7-7700HQ-QC-Processor-NVIDIA-GTX-1050Ti-4GB-Graphics-Card-12GB-Memory-1TB-Hard-Drive/630174927 https://www.walmart.com/ip/HP-Omen-15-ax250wm-15-6-Full-HD-I... Screen: 13" vs 15.6" RAM: 8GB vs 12GB CPU: i5 vs i7 Intel Iris Plus Graphics 640 vs GTX 1050Ti 4GB 128GB SSD vs 1TB HDD, you can buy your own 1TB SSD for around $150, far from the $800 upcharge Apple wants to charge you for that option And mine doesn't need dongles to do basic tasks like plug in a mouse or ethernet cable or monitor. I've used Mac OS for a week at a time and it really seemed like nothing special. So $500 less and I get a bigger screen, more RAM, better CPU, much better GPU, much better disk space, actual USB/HDMI/ethernet ports, with no tangible downsides unless for some reason you literally cannot just get used to using Windows 10, which is a perfectly fine OS. Plus being able to run basically whatever games I want. Edit: And I just noticed the MBP doesn't even have a numpad. Another dealbreaker for me.

foldr 7y ago
Doesn't the model you link to have a non-retina display? It's hardly comparable. You're not paying for raw specs when you buy a mac. You're paying for the screen, the trackpad, the aesthetics, the thin profile, the battery life, the speakers and microphone, and the OS. Apple has the good taste not to max out the specs if it means sacrificing other, more important features. If you look for Windows laptops that check all the aforementioned boxes (leaving aside the trackpad, as none of them have good trackpads), you'll be paying just as much as you pay for a macbook.
- jimmaswell 7y ago
  Ok, here's something 4K with same or better other specs compared to mine, at $1000. https://www.amazon.com/VivoBook-Touchscreen-i7-7700HQ-GeForce-Essentials/dp/B077X9D48G https://www.amazon.com/VivoBook-Touchscreen-i7-7700HQ-GeForc... I've used the trackpad and looked at the screens of MBPs and it was nothing special. Didn't even realize the resolution was more than normal 1080p at the time. Battery life/speakers/microphone/trackpad are fine on mine. I don't see how you could think aesthetics are important enough to skimp out on power.
  - foldr 7y ago
    You can get a macbook air for not much more than $1000, with all the advantages that I mentioned. The ASUS laptop you link to has a poor battery life. You can't seriously claim that the macbook trackpads are not ahead of the competition. >Didn't even realize the resolution was more than normal 1080p at the time. Ok, but macbooks are targeted at the majority of people who can easily tell the difference.
    - jimmaswell 7y ago
      I'm sure I could tell it was over 1080p if I was paying close attention. It's mostly just passing familiarity being around coworker computers. Maybe Macbook trackpads really are that great but I have no complaints about mine. And I'm sure the battery life is fine if you turn on power saving features and don't leave intensive stuff running.