4 ms·

My instinct is that you're probably correct, and most planes are probably riddled with similar problems and would look bad if they came under the same scrutiny

My instinct is that you're probably correct, and most planes are probably riddled with similar problems and would look bad if they came under the same scrutiny as the 737 Max is currently under. For example, I remember after the 787 was launched there was a few stories in the press about the batteries catching fire mid-flight, but it turned out the designers and engineers had accounted for that possibility and it wasn't really a big deal. They've improved the batteries, but it didn't actually hurt anybody. However, the problem with the max seems to be that instead of designing for failure - assuming that critical systems might fail and the plane should recover gracefully from the failure of most internal systems - they seem to have designed for success, and made the assumption that no part of the plane will ever fail. And that's obviously not realistic, and we're seeing the consequences of it here.

vkou 7y ago
> My instinct is that you're probably correct, and most planes are probably riddled with similar problems and would look bad if they came under the same scrutiny as the 737 Max is currently under. The 737 MAX only looks bad because it's track record so far is that it's a death trap.
CaptainZapp 7y ago
I remember after the 787 was launched there was a few stories in the press about the batteries catching fire mid-flight, but it turned out the designers and engineers had accounted for that possibility and it wasn't really a big deal. It was a huge deal and the plane was grounded for three month due to those battery fires. Originally the engineers did not account for battery fires and needed to refit a compartment to seal the batteries in case a fire occurs. Luckily it was either on approach, or they could emergency land the plane when the problem occured. A burning lithium battery in a flying plane is one of the worst imaginable scenarios you can encounter during a flight and is a fucking big deal. Edited to add : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_787_Dreamliner_battery_problems https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_787_Dreamliner_battery_...
rsynnott 7y ago
> My instinct is that you're probably correct, and most planes are probably riddled with similar problems and would look bad if they came under the same scrutiny as the 737 Max is currently under. 0.5% of all 737 MAXes which exist have killed everyone on board. No other mass market production airliner in recent history has that sort of record, AFAIK.
- AnimalMuppet 7y ago
  Wikipedia says 393 have been produced, so more like 0.25%.
  - BorRagnarok 7y ago
    2 out of 393 is roughly 0.5%
    - AnimalMuppet 7y ago
      <facepalm>
- opencl 7y ago
  The rate of fatal crashes is more than an order of magnitude higher than anything introduced in the past 30 years. The Concorde is the only thing that's worse. The A310 is closer than anything else at 1.35 fatal crashes per million miles vs the 737 MAX's 3.08- and that one was also designed to share a common type rating with an existing design. http://www.airsafe.com/events/models/rate_mod.htm http://www.airsafe.com/events/models/rate_mod.htm

vkou 7y ago

> My instinct is that you're probably correct, and most planes are probably riddled with similar problems and would look bad if they came under the same scrutiny as the 737 Max is currently under. The 737 MAX only looks bad because it's track record so far is that it's a death trap.

CaptainZapp 7y ago

I remember after the 787 was launched there was a few stories in the press about the batteries catching fire mid-flight, but it turned out the designers and engineers had accounted for that possibility and it wasn't really a big deal. It was a huge deal and the plane was grounded for three month due to those battery fires. Originally the engineers did not account for battery fires and needed to refit a compartment to seal the batteries in case a fire occurs. Luckily it was either on approach, or they could emergency land the plane when the problem occured. A burning lithium battery in a flying plane is one of the worst imaginable scenarios you can encounter during a flight and is a fucking big deal. Edited to add : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_787_Dreamliner_battery_problems https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_787_Dreamliner_battery_...

rsynnott 7y ago

> My instinct is that you're probably correct, and most planes are probably riddled with similar problems and would look bad if they came under the same scrutiny as the 737 Max is currently under. 0.5% of all 737 MAXes which exist have killed everyone on board. No other mass market production airliner in recent history has that sort of record, AFAIK.

AnimalMuppet 7y ago
Wikipedia says 393 have been produced, so more like 0.25%.
- BorRagnarok 7y ago
  2 out of 393 is roughly 0.5%
  - AnimalMuppet 7y ago
    <facepalm>
opencl 7y ago
The rate of fatal crashes is more than an order of magnitude higher than anything introduced in the past 30 years. The Concorde is the only thing that's worse. The A310 is closer than anything else at 1.35 fatal crashes per million miles vs the 737 MAX's 3.08- and that one was also designed to share a common type rating with an existing design. http://www.airsafe.com/events/models/rate_mod.htm http://www.airsafe.com/events/models/rate_mod.htm