4 ms·

My favorite OSX version and my favorite animal. It's an incredibly agile animal. The animals are taking their toll from the insatible greediness of wild capital

My favorite OSX version and my favorite animal. It's an incredibly agile animal. The animals are taking their toll from the insatible greediness of wild capitalism.

Fjolsvith 7y ago
In California, of all places!
- supergauntlet 7y ago
  California is full of the worst kinds of "crony capitalism" (that is, regulatory capture, a feature and not a bug of capitalism unfortunately), what do you mean?
  - aurora72 7y ago
    I mean deforestation devitalization denaturalization devastation of nature of any kind for any purpose whether for capitalism or some other thingism.
  - aeorgnoieang 7y ago
    > regulatory capture, a feature and not a bug of capitalism unfortunately That seems pretty uncharitable. Would you agree that mass murder is a 'feature and not a bug' of communism? The fact that you're aware of 'crony capitalism' would otherwise imply that you're aware that the cronyism is not considered a feature.
  - Fjolsvith 7y ago
    It just seemed to me that out of the entire United States, California was the state with the best environmentally conscious lawmakers out there.
    - ha99ja 7y ago
      You would think... First time I went there I had a version of the Paris Syndrome[1]. I was expecting beautiful, clean, and preserved nature and what I saw was oil refineries on the ocean (chevron in el segundo) water so filled with bacteria after it rains you will get hepatitis if you go in it, extreme vehicle pollution, oil drilling in the city [2]! Granted I still like it there, but the illusion of California being an eco-friendly place was completely shot. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_syndrome https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_syndrome [2] https://la.curbed.com/maps/oil-los-angeles-drill-sites-offshore https://la.curbed.com/maps/oil-los-angeles-drill-sites-offsh...
  - wahern 7y ago
    I don't think that's an even remotely accurate statement of California. I think the problem is precisely the opposite--the 1960s and 1970s brought a raft of political and legal changes in California in response to crony capitalism. The irony is that in some respects, at least, the cure was worse than the disease. In general the changes emphasized community involvement and participation in the application and enforcement of policy. But they arguably made this too easy. Take the California Environment Quality Act (CEQA), for example. Under CEQA anyone can challenge a development project regardless of the direct effect on them, and there are effectively no repercussions for abusing this. San Francisco is a microcosm of the statewide problem. Almost everything the city does, from infrastructure projects to permit approvals, requires "community input", which activists effectively use to drag out deliberations on even minor matters for years. The approval process for the biggest changes in the city, such as the towers downtown and the Mission Bay development projects, began in the 1990s. Notably that was before the two dotcom bubbles and the housing crisis made everybody city planning experts and community activists. Such large scale development would be strangled at birth by activists today even though they're merely replacing dirty industrial sites and adding net housing (as opposed to the pre-1980s projects that literally razed communities and kicked people out onto the streets--e.g. the I-Hotel[1]). So I think the problem isn't crony capitalism--not generally. I think a better description of this is mob rule reflecting sanctimonious populism. Some companies have become quite adept at staying under the radar--not to avoid the law, but to avoid the attention of activists and communities.[2] But I don't think we should confuse that sort of bureaucratic sophistication with cronyism, graft, rule avoidance, and similar types of behavior. California isn't even remotely comparable to states like New Jersey, Illinois, or Alabama in this regard; California companies are angelic by comparison. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Hotel_(San_Francisco) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Hotel_(San_Franc... [2] Political leaders do this too for entirely pure-of-heart reasons. It's little known that the long-term plan for the Great Highway along the west coast of SF is for it to be demolished. Rather than attempting to mitigate coastal erosion along the southern end, they're simply going to close it. They "schemed" with California officials and the Federal government (who controls the beach and, I think, the technically the highway itself) to develop an environmental plan to store the habitat. This nominally comports with the express wishes of California and San Francisco voters. But if people actually caught wind of this everybody would freak out because the Great Highway is now heavily trafficked, especially during commute hours. So AFAICT there's a "conspiracy" by city politicians, environmentalists, and the Feds to formalize and set into the motion the long-term plan before anyone notices to effectively challenge it.
edhelas 7y ago
Not sure if you're trying to link OSX and capitalism there.
- aurora72 7y ago
  No. The Lion and M.Lion OSX are really good. Maybe the best I can link are the BSD and some craftmanship on top of it.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
tengbretson 7y ago
> The animals are taking their toll from the insatible greediness of wild capitalism. When all you have is a hammer...

My favorite OSX version and my favorite animal. It's an incredibly agile animal. The animals are taking their toll from the insatible greediness of wild capitalism.

Fjolsvith 7y ago

In California, of all places!

supergauntlet 7y ago
California is full of the worst kinds of "crony capitalism" (that is, regulatory capture, a feature and not a bug of capitalism unfortunately), what do you mean?
- aurora72 7y ago
  I mean deforestation devitalization denaturalization devastation of nature of any kind for any purpose whether for capitalism or some other thingism.
- aeorgnoieang 7y ago
  > regulatory capture, a feature and not a bug of capitalism unfortunately That seems pretty uncharitable. Would you agree that mass murder is a 'feature and not a bug' of communism? The fact that you're aware of 'crony capitalism' would otherwise imply that you're aware that the cronyism is not considered a feature.
- Fjolsvith 7y ago
  It just seemed to me that out of the entire United States, California was the state with the best environmentally conscious lawmakers out there.
  - ha99ja 7y ago
    You would think... First time I went there I had a version of the Paris Syndrome[1]. I was expecting beautiful, clean, and preserved nature and what I saw was oil refineries on the ocean (chevron in el segundo) water so filled with bacteria after it rains you will get hepatitis if you go in it, extreme vehicle pollution, oil drilling in the city [2]! Granted I still like it there, but the illusion of California being an eco-friendly place was completely shot. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_syndrome https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris_syndrome [2] https://la.curbed.com/maps/oil-los-angeles-drill-sites-offshore https://la.curbed.com/maps/oil-los-angeles-drill-sites-offsh...
- wahern 7y ago
  I don't think that's an even remotely accurate statement of California. I think the problem is precisely the opposite--the 1960s and 1970s brought a raft of political and legal changes in California in response to crony capitalism. The irony is that in some respects, at least, the cure was worse than the disease. In general the changes emphasized community involvement and participation in the application and enforcement of policy. But they arguably made this too easy. Take the California Environment Quality Act (CEQA), for example. Under CEQA anyone can challenge a development project regardless of the direct effect on them, and there are effectively no repercussions for abusing this. San Francisco is a microcosm of the statewide problem. Almost everything the city does, from infrastructure projects to permit approvals, requires "community input", which activists effectively use to drag out deliberations on even minor matters for years. The approval process for the biggest changes in the city, such as the towers downtown and the Mission Bay development projects, began in the 1990s. Notably that was before the two dotcom bubbles and the housing crisis made everybody city planning experts and community activists. Such large scale development would be strangled at birth by activists today even though they're merely replacing dirty industrial sites and adding net housing (as opposed to the pre-1980s projects that literally razed communities and kicked people out onto the streets--e.g. the I-Hotel[1]). So I think the problem isn't crony capitalism--not generally. I think a better description of this is mob rule reflecting sanctimonious populism. Some companies have become quite adept at staying under the radar--not to avoid the law, but to avoid the attention of activists and communities.[2] But I don't think we should confuse that sort of bureaucratic sophistication with cronyism, graft, rule avoidance, and similar types of behavior. California isn't even remotely comparable to states like New Jersey, Illinois, or Alabama in this regard; California companies are angelic by comparison. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Hotel_(San_Francisco) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Hotel_(San_Franc... [2] Political leaders do this too for entirely pure-of-heart reasons. It's little known that the long-term plan for the Great Highway along the west coast of SF is for it to be demolished. Rather than attempting to mitigate coastal erosion along the southern end, they're simply going to close it. They "schemed" with California officials and the Federal government (who controls the beach and, I think, the technically the highway itself) to develop an environmental plan to store the habitat. This nominally comports with the express wishes of California and San Francisco voters. But if people actually caught wind of this everybody would freak out because the Great Highway is now heavily trafficked, especially during commute hours. So AFAICT there's a "conspiracy" by city politicians, environmentalists, and the Feds to formalize and set into the motion the long-term plan before anyone notices to effectively challenge it.

edhelas 7y ago

Not sure if you're trying to link OSX and capitalism there.

aurora72 7y ago
No. The Lion and M.Lion OSX are really good. Maybe the best I can link are the BSD and some craftmanship on top of it.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

tengbretson 7y ago

> The animals are taking their toll from the insatible greediness of wild capitalism. When all you have is a hammer...