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I hate air dryers perhaps slightly too vehemently. I think it would be a net positive even if they were simply removed from everywhere without replacement. I'm

I hate air dryers perhaps slightly too vehemently. I think it would be a net positive even if they were simply removed from everywhere without replacement. I'm not sure why they're so common given that they seem to only make things worse.

Reason077 7y ago
But what are the alternatives? - Paper towels? Environmentally unsound. - Washable towel on a continuous roller/spindle thing? Common in past decades, now pretty rare. Requires regular servicing. Expensive? [1] - Don’t offer hand drying at all? Uncomfortable especially in cold climates. Might discourage people from washing their hands at all. While I agree they need to be quieter, Hand dryers are still the best technology we have right now. [1] The British Library still uses these in their washrooms, presumably because of noise concerns with hand dryers.
- gambiting 7y ago
  While I was at uni just few years ago all bathrooms had the towel on the roller. The main issue was that by the end of the day the entire roll has been used so you either re-used the same final patch of the towel that everyone already used, or don't dry your hands. Otherwise, great idea.
- chousuke 7y ago
  I'm a proponent of cloth rolls. Toilets need regular maintenance anyway. Perhaps an air blower would function as a backup, but I'd honestly prefer drying my hands on my clothes, since in my experience air dryers are either ineffective or in the case of air blade systems so nasty that I don't want to go anywhere near one.
- __s 7y ago
  Live in the cold climate of Canada. I dry my hands by slapping my pants when I walk away from the sink. Then again, I also eschewed towels for the longest time in favor of slapping myself dry after showers
- a_imho 7y ago
  Paper towels? Environmentally unsound. I don't see why these paper towels would not be 100% recyclable or that much different to regular toilet paper. Also, what if people would like to wash other body parts that can't be put in an airblade e.g. face?
  - penagwin 7y ago
    I'm not sure why you're being downvoted, I mean I know why people are but I don't think they should be. You're forgetting that we have to create paper towels/toilet paper, etc. from trees. And we aren't just talking a few trees, it's a deforestation issue. Sure we could replant trees, etc, etc, but it still destroys the current eco-systems living there.
  - merpnderp 7y ago
    As long as they come from farmed trees and wind up composted, they're actually sinking carbon out of the air. Maybe it's not a net win because of the energy used to create them and move them around, but towel itself will lock its carbon in the soil for quite some time.
- Cthulhu_ 7y ago
  Paper towels are recyclable and made out of recycled paper, at least. They are the most hygienic solution out there. I still see the towel rolls around, they're a good option as well. Maintenance for (esp. public) toilets is never not going to be a thing, but it does require a bit more infrastructure to maintain (= washing out etc). But there's companies that will take care of that. Not offering hand drying is the worst; drying your hands is arguably even more important than washing them when it comes to hygiene. Anyway beyond that, fixing the hand dryers is also an option. Use larger but slower rotating fans. Dyson's machines have the problem that they have relatively small, high-speed motors.
  - mattmanser 7y ago
    They're not recyclable. If they're made from recycled paper, their fibres will be too short, like tissue paper or toilet roll. On top of that, people might be using it to wipe anything, which could potentially ruin the rest of the recycling. If you're putting any of that into your recycling, you're doing it wrong. Also, do not recycle any paper/cardboard with grease or food contamination, especially pizza boxes with grease on, they will also ruin a recycling run.
    - edflsafoiewq 7y ago
      IME paper towels always go into the regular trash. Is this unsustainable? I thought paper was pretty environmentally sound.
      - smolder 7y ago
        For paper producers who replant the trees they log, they're actually sinking carbon so that's good. If they don't replace the trees, no bueno.
    - cabaalis 7y ago
      > If you're putting any of that into your recycling, you're doing it wrong. Hence the main problem with recycling. No reasonable person can know all the rules about plastics, what kinds of papers, etc. Why can't sorters sort it all out? Because nobody knows what to pre-sort.
- fiblye 7y ago
  Maybe I'm filthy, but I've always just patted the back of my shirt unless I'm in a place with clean cloth towels available. It's not the outside temperature that'd discourage the already apparently slim number of people that do bother to wash their hands. It's water temperature. And if the water is freezing, no drying method will get the average joe to endure the pain of water hitting their hands.
- xxs 7y ago
  "Paper towels?" yes, paper towels, perfectly recyclable and hygienic. Allows wiping face/neck as well. I don't get the discouraging part and cold climates. It requires hot water, but that's it.
  - mattmanser 7y ago
    See above, learn how to recycle properly, you shouldn't be recycling paper towels.
    - xxs 7y ago
      Appreciate it. So the towels are good for compost and they can't be recycled any longer.
  - thom 7y ago
    Yeah, it always annoys me when it's impossible to splash water on my face and dry it (perhaps I am a uniquely sweaty mess, I dunno). With most dryers you have to make some sort of cup shape to rebound the air into your face, and that's if you aren't instantly thinking of all the germs blasting out.
  - adrianmonk 7y ago
    Even with hot water, evaporation rapidly cools the water and your hands get cold.
- distances 7y ago
  > - Washable towel on a continuous roller/spindle thing? Common in past decades, now pretty rare. Requires regular servicing. Expensive? [1] Not true by my experience. I'd say maybe a third of the toilets I use (in Europe) have these cloth rolls.
Spooky23 7y ago
They are cheap. That’s why they exist. Bathroom operators give zero shits about the environment. With paper towels, you need to visit a busy bathroom a few times a day to empty the trash.
dngray 7y ago
> I hate air dryers perhaps slightly too vehemently. When I was little I used to be worried they would eat my fingers, particularly ones that looked like https://i.imgur.com/hCMAQV7.jpg https://i.imgur.com/hCMAQV7.jpg with that little shiny metal dome. It kind of made me think it was hot and i'd somehow burn myself. I wonder whether those super-fast ones (like the dyson airblades) are better or worse for children these days.
pwg 7y ago
> I'm not sure why they're so common given that they seem to only make things worse. Air hand dryer: One purchase - zero daily maintenance needs. Paper towels: Continuous purchase expense (buying new stock) - continuous daily maintenance needs (resupply of dispenser), increased refuse expense (all the discarded paper towels increase the refuse stream size). When you tally up the expenses for "air dryer" vs. "paper towels" for a busy restroom and over a reasonable time span (say 1 year) the cost differential is why air dryers are so common. Of course, some owners also advertise the environmental aspects, but the true reality is the air dryer is there because it saves the restroom owner a significant amount of money each year.
- freehunter 7y ago
  The "zero maintenance" is part of the problem. Any hand dryer should have an air filter, and that air filter should need to be replaced frequently considering the nasty things that happen in that room.

Reason077 7y ago

But what are the alternatives? - Paper towels? Environmentally unsound. - Washable towel on a continuous roller/spindle thing? Common in past decades, now pretty rare. Requires regular servicing. Expensive? [1] - Don’t offer hand drying at all? Uncomfortable especially in cold climates. Might discourage people from washing their hands at all. While I agree they need to be quieter, Hand dryers are still the best technology we have right now. [1] The British Library still uses these in their washrooms, presumably because of noise concerns with hand dryers.

gambiting 7y ago
While I was at uni just few years ago all bathrooms had the towel on the roller. The main issue was that by the end of the day the entire roll has been used so you either re-used the same final patch of the towel that everyone already used, or don't dry your hands. Otherwise, great idea.
chousuke 7y ago
I'm a proponent of cloth rolls. Toilets need regular maintenance anyway. Perhaps an air blower would function as a backup, but I'd honestly prefer drying my hands on my clothes, since in my experience air dryers are either ineffective or in the case of air blade systems so nasty that I don't want to go anywhere near one.
__s 7y ago
Live in the cold climate of Canada. I dry my hands by slapping my pants when I walk away from the sink. Then again, I also eschewed towels for the longest time in favor of slapping myself dry after showers
a_imho 7y ago
Paper towels? Environmentally unsound. I don't see why these paper towels would not be 100% recyclable or that much different to regular toilet paper. Also, what if people would like to wash other body parts that can't be put in an airblade e.g. face?
- penagwin 7y ago
  I'm not sure why you're being downvoted, I mean I know why people are but I don't think they should be. You're forgetting that we have to create paper towels/toilet paper, etc. from trees. And we aren't just talking a few trees, it's a deforestation issue. Sure we could replant trees, etc, etc, but it still destroys the current eco-systems living there.
- merpnderp 7y ago
  As long as they come from farmed trees and wind up composted, they're actually sinking carbon out of the air. Maybe it's not a net win because of the energy used to create them and move them around, but towel itself will lock its carbon in the soil for quite some time.
Cthulhu_ 7y ago
Paper towels are recyclable and made out of recycled paper, at least. They are the most hygienic solution out there. I still see the towel rolls around, they're a good option as well. Maintenance for (esp. public) toilets is never not going to be a thing, but it does require a bit more infrastructure to maintain (= washing out etc). But there's companies that will take care of that. Not offering hand drying is the worst; drying your hands is arguably even more important than washing them when it comes to hygiene. Anyway beyond that, fixing the hand dryers is also an option. Use larger but slower rotating fans. Dyson's machines have the problem that they have relatively small, high-speed motors.
- mattmanser 7y ago
  They're not recyclable. If they're made from recycled paper, their fibres will be too short, like tissue paper or toilet roll. On top of that, people might be using it to wipe anything, which could potentially ruin the rest of the recycling. If you're putting any of that into your recycling, you're doing it wrong. Also, do not recycle any paper/cardboard with grease or food contamination, especially pizza boxes with grease on, they will also ruin a recycling run.
  - edflsafoiewq 7y ago
    IME paper towels always go into the regular trash. Is this unsustainable? I thought paper was pretty environmentally sound.
    - smolder 7y ago
      For paper producers who replant the trees they log, they're actually sinking carbon so that's good. If they don't replace the trees, no bueno.
  - cabaalis 7y ago
    > If you're putting any of that into your recycling, you're doing it wrong. Hence the main problem with recycling. No reasonable person can know all the rules about plastics, what kinds of papers, etc. Why can't sorters sort it all out? Because nobody knows what to pre-sort.
fiblye 7y ago
Maybe I'm filthy, but I've always just patted the back of my shirt unless I'm in a place with clean cloth towels available. It's not the outside temperature that'd discourage the already apparently slim number of people that do bother to wash their hands. It's water temperature. And if the water is freezing, no drying method will get the average joe to endure the pain of water hitting their hands.
xxs 7y ago
"Paper towels?" yes, paper towels, perfectly recyclable and hygienic. Allows wiping face/neck as well. I don't get the discouraging part and cold climates. It requires hot water, but that's it.
- mattmanser 7y ago
  See above, learn how to recycle properly, you shouldn't be recycling paper towels.
  - xxs 7y ago
    Appreciate it. So the towels are good for compost and they can't be recycled any longer.
- thom 7y ago
  Yeah, it always annoys me when it's impossible to splash water on my face and dry it (perhaps I am a uniquely sweaty mess, I dunno). With most dryers you have to make some sort of cup shape to rebound the air into your face, and that's if you aren't instantly thinking of all the germs blasting out.
- adrianmonk 7y ago
  Even with hot water, evaporation rapidly cools the water and your hands get cold.
distances 7y ago
> - Washable towel on a continuous roller/spindle thing? Common in past decades, now pretty rare. Requires regular servicing. Expensive? [1] Not true by my experience. I'd say maybe a third of the toilets I use (in Europe) have these cloth rolls.

Spooky23 7y ago

They are cheap. That’s why they exist. Bathroom operators give zero shits about the environment. With paper towels, you need to visit a busy bathroom a few times a day to empty the trash.

dngray 7y ago

> I hate air dryers perhaps slightly too vehemently. When I was little I used to be worried they would eat my fingers, particularly ones that looked like https://i.imgur.com/hCMAQV7.jpg https://i.imgur.com/hCMAQV7.jpg with that little shiny metal dome. It kind of made me think it was hot and i'd somehow burn myself. I wonder whether those super-fast ones (like the dyson airblades) are better or worse for children these days.

pwg 7y ago

> I'm not sure why they're so common given that they seem to only make things worse. Air hand dryer: One purchase - zero daily maintenance needs. Paper towels: Continuous purchase expense (buying new stock) - continuous daily maintenance needs (resupply of dispenser), increased refuse expense (all the discarded paper towels increase the refuse stream size). When you tally up the expenses for "air dryer" vs. "paper towels" for a busy restroom and over a reasonable time span (say 1 year) the cost differential is why air dryers are so common. Of course, some owners also advertise the environmental aspects, but the true reality is the air dryer is there because it saves the restroom owner a significant amount of money each year.

freehunter 7y ago
The "zero maintenance" is part of the problem. Any hand dryer should have an air filter, and that air filter should need to be replaced frequently considering the nasty things that happen in that room.