3 ms·

I'm not sure about the amount of gas, however it is quite common to make the ground floor of concrete here in Norway. However it's not solid, it has a core of

by tyfon 7y ago

I'm not sure about the amount of gas, however it is quite common to make the ground floor of concrete here in Norway. However it's not solid, it has a core of Styrofoam to insulate so it. The rest of the houses are usually of wood/glass that is heavily insulated. It would be interesting to see if you could make the foundations out of wood or something like that instead. All new buildings has to adhere to very strict codes of how to be constructed [1]. We also have the worlds tallest wooden building [2] here so maybe this is the future instead of concrete/steel skyscrapers. [1] https://dibk.no/byggereglene/byggteknisk-forskrift-tek17/ https://dibk.no/byggereglene/byggteknisk-forskrift-tek17/ [2] https://www.dezeen.com/2019/03/19/mjostarne-worlds-tallest-timber-tower-voll-arkitekter-norway/ https://www.dezeen.com/2019/03/19/mjostarne-worlds-tallest-t...

cheerlessbog 7y ago
I hope that wooden building has excellent (and redundant) sprinklers. It didn't mention fireproof treatment of some kind. Grenfell showed how fast a tower can burn if it's flammable.
- SECProto 7y ago
  Structural properties are interesting. Fires are a combination of fuel, oxidizer, and initiator. Can't really avoid the last one, accidents happen, but you can slow it down. Grenfell was interesting. My understanding (inquiry is still ongoing, so conditional): because the panels are so thin, they have much larger oxidizer availability to the fuel - like burning a piece of paper held vertically, the rising flames will spread and consume available fuel quickly. Mass timber, on the other hand, is fairly resistant to fire [1] - initiates slowly, takes a long time to burn through - it's what makes logs in a wood stove burn over hours, not seconds. And while the outside is slowly charring, the core maintains structural strength - quite unlike structural steel as it heats (the steel connectors in this building are actually one of the weak points! [1]). Sprinklers in any high rise is necessary to ensure it has an adequate fire rating (eg, it will remain structurally stable/safe for 2 hours is I think the standard in my country?). It's not like taking a stick built house and making it taller. Caveat: I have studied structures/fire rating stuff, but am not a professional. [1] for your further reading pleasure: https://www.moelven.com/news/news-archive2/2018/how-the-worlds-tallest-timber-building-withstands-fire/ https://www.moelven.com/news/news-archive2/2018/how-the-worl...

by tyfon 7y ago

cheerlessbog 7y ago

I hope that wooden building has excellent (and redundant) sprinklers. It didn't mention fireproof treatment of some kind. Grenfell showed how fast a tower can burn if it's flammable.

SECProto 7y ago
Structural properties are interesting. Fires are a combination of fuel, oxidizer, and initiator. Can't really avoid the last one, accidents happen, but you can slow it down. Grenfell was interesting. My understanding (inquiry is still ongoing, so conditional): because the panels are so thin, they have much larger oxidizer availability to the fuel - like burning a piece of paper held vertically, the rising flames will spread and consume available fuel quickly. Mass timber, on the other hand, is fairly resistant to fire [1] - initiates slowly, takes a long time to burn through - it's what makes logs in a wood stove burn over hours, not seconds. And while the outside is slowly charring, the core maintains structural strength - quite unlike structural steel as it heats (the steel connectors in this building are actually one of the weak points! [1]). Sprinklers in any high rise is necessary to ensure it has an adequate fire rating (eg, it will remain structurally stable/safe for 2 hours is I think the standard in my country?). It's not like taking a stick built house and making it taller. Caveat: I have studied structures/fire rating stuff, but am not a professional. [1] for your further reading pleasure: https://www.moelven.com/news/news-archive2/2018/how-the-worlds-tallest-timber-building-withstands-fire/ https://www.moelven.com/news/news-archive2/2018/how-the-worl...