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Big houses in the burbs is not what life is like for everyone getting worried about age discrimination now. Imagine this: You took your university education a

Big houses in the burbs is not what life is like for everyone getting worried about age discrimination now. Imagine this: You took your university education a bit too seriously, entering the workforce after completing a PhD at age, say, 25, immediately after the 2008-crash. That means you're too young to have been around in the 80s, inventing the world's first online banking or whatever. You were never part of the dot-com bonanza of the 90s. Your parents are probably still alive and you never got any inheritance. You command a medium-level income with your mediocre career, but having had to move to a tech hub (or a major city at least) has meant that you never got much of a chance for your income to turn into savings, due to not having had a chance to get on the real estate ladder and your income going to the landlord and taxman. You're now 36 and starting to get worried if you'll be able to find another job in this industry if you should lose the one you have now. Lucky you.

scarface74 7y ago
What would have happened had they spent some time researching and knowing that from a financial standpoint that a PhD does not statistically give you a great ROI? - most major cities not on the west coast you would be fine with a “medium level” by HN standards salary of low six figures. - In most major cities not on the west coast or NYC, you can still buy a decent home making low six figures. By the time I was 36, I had stayed at one job way too long, I was the stereotypical “expert beginner” and was just starting to job hop and my career trajectory from the time I was 35 until now 10 years later looks like that of someone just starting out and moving up for the last ten years. No hint of age discrimination - only a couple of rejections in the course of five job changes - and since I always use recruiters, my resume has never gone down a black hole. The last ten years I’ve been a regular old journeyman enterprise software/SAAS developer -> team lead -> architect/principal developer.
- stakhanov 7y ago
  Good for you, but the tone you're taking in your comment is not quite appropriate. Many people still want PhDs for reasons having nothing to do with financial considerations. Also: I'm writing from the POV of someone outside the United States, specifically from someone based in Europe. The system in the U.S. is based on a squeezed/dying middle class. In large parts of Europe, middle class is all there is. With high taxes, wealth transfers from the rich to the poor, and many policies that have the effect of keeping people wealthy but cash-poor (mandatory social security of all kinds imaginable), and with super-high real estate prices in basically all areas that will make it possible to work in tech, the ability to get on the real estate ladder is now no longer a given, even for someone with a six-figure-usd-equivalent salary, which are actually much rarer in Europe, even in tech, than they are the U.S.
  - scarface74 7y ago
    There is nothing wrong with wanting a PhD for other than financial reasons, but they can’t complain about the well known consequences of their decision. That’s like someone getting a degree in Ancient Chinese Art History and wondering why they can’t find a job. But, like you said, this is coming from my American perspective - the only one I know. Also, is the tech bro culture a thing in Europe?
    - stakhanov 7y ago
      Re tech bro: Personally, having worked for maybe half a dozen European-based tech companies, I've experienced two companies where I felt a bit out of the loop socially for not joining them when they played table football or went to the indoor climbing arena after work etc. But they were always peer groups of people situated below decision-making level. So there was never anyone who could actually decide things that might be bad for my career, leaving me to wonder whether me not being a bro was what it was about.
russdpale 7y ago
Jesus do you know me? Everything is accurate except the PhD part.

scarface74 7y ago

What would have happened had they spent some time researching and knowing that from a financial standpoint that a PhD does not statistically give you a great ROI? - most major cities not on the west coast you would be fine with a “medium level” by HN standards salary of low six figures. - In most major cities not on the west coast or NYC, you can still buy a decent home making low six figures. By the time I was 36, I had stayed at one job way too long, I was the stereotypical “expert beginner” and was just starting to job hop and my career trajectory from the time I was 35 until now 10 years later looks like that of someone just starting out and moving up for the last ten years. No hint of age discrimination - only a couple of rejections in the course of five job changes - and since I always use recruiters, my resume has never gone down a black hole. The last ten years I’ve been a regular old journeyman enterprise software/SAAS developer -> team lead -> architect/principal developer.

stakhanov 7y ago
Good for you, but the tone you're taking in your comment is not quite appropriate. Many people still want PhDs for reasons having nothing to do with financial considerations. Also: I'm writing from the POV of someone outside the United States, specifically from someone based in Europe. The system in the U.S. is based on a squeezed/dying middle class. In large parts of Europe, middle class is all there is. With high taxes, wealth transfers from the rich to the poor, and many policies that have the effect of keeping people wealthy but cash-poor (mandatory social security of all kinds imaginable), and with super-high real estate prices in basically all areas that will make it possible to work in tech, the ability to get on the real estate ladder is now no longer a given, even for someone with a six-figure-usd-equivalent salary, which are actually much rarer in Europe, even in tech, than they are the U.S.
- scarface74 7y ago
  There is nothing wrong with wanting a PhD for other than financial reasons, but they can’t complain about the well known consequences of their decision. That’s like someone getting a degree in Ancient Chinese Art History and wondering why they can’t find a job. But, like you said, this is coming from my American perspective - the only one I know. Also, is the tech bro culture a thing in Europe?
  - stakhanov 7y ago
    Re tech bro: Personally, having worked for maybe half a dozen European-based tech companies, I've experienced two companies where I felt a bit out of the loop socially for not joining them when they played table football or went to the indoor climbing arena after work etc. But they were always peer groups of people situated below decision-making level. So there was never anyone who could actually decide things that might be bad for my career, leaving me to wonder whether me not being a bro was what it was about.

russdpale 7y ago

Jesus do you know me? Everything is accurate except the PhD part.