4 ms·

In the United states this has been an issue at Frys electronics and circuit city, but it really boils down to these two facts: - once you pay, and have a recei

In the United states this has been an issue at Frys electronics and circuit city, but it really boils down to these two facts: - once you pay, and have a receipt, it is your property. - guards can only do one of two things: 1. wave you by and tell you to have a nice day or 2. Detain you for shoplifting. number 2 gets pretty ugly. If the "loss prevention officer" as theyre called has video evidence of you stealing, or can prove from witness that you are in possession of stolen property, they will detain you in standard police style handcuffs and march you to the office. only the police can legally remove the handcuffs at this point. now, if you havent stolen anything, and you are detained, this is unlawful imprisonment. You hire a lawyer, you go to court, and you count your settlement cash or push the company to do the unthinkable...not issue a public apology, but admit wrongdoing. most companies have shied away from this kind of strongman tactic of inspecting bags for one reason. its not because customers dont like it, its because it can put the business at enormous financial and shareholder risk if it backfires for any reason.

masonic 7y ago
Costco, however, is a membership organization, and this is a stated condition in the membership agreement.
- the_pwner224 7y ago
  You can't use a contract to sign away your right to not be enslaved (with the exception of prisoners). Similarly you can't sign away your right to not be illegally held captive by another person. Of course if you leave without allowing Costco to check your bag, they have every right to cancel the contract which was breached. But if they don't let you leave and handcuff you, you have every right to sue them.
  - threatofrain 7y ago
    This works at the airports; is there legal clarity or consensus on what kinds of rights you can't give away?
    - reaperducer 7y ago
      Airports are different. They're the property of governments or quangos like airport authorities. There, the people checking you are government employees acting on behalf of the government for the public good. A 17-year-old at Best Buy is only acting on a power trip enabled by his boss, and has zero legal authority to detain you if you're not stealing anything.
Zak 7y ago
> only the police can legally remove the handcuffs at this point. That doesn't sound quite right to me. Do you have a citation?
pessimizer 7y ago
...and 3. 86 you. The proportion of innocent people who will turn down a bag check if it means they can't return to a local retailer I estimate at 0.1%. For any right not to be searched to be meaningful, I'd have to be a right not to habe a search requested of you. Especially since the outcome of refusing a search will likely be a policeman searching you in the parking lot, or on the side of the road during your walk/drive home.
- Zak 7y ago
  I have refused such a check at Walmart and the result was an employee trying to physically obstruct my exit from the store, accusing me of stealing, and calling me rude names. I left anyway. No cops. No attempt to ban me from the store.

masonic 7y ago

Costco, however, is a membership organization, and this is a stated condition in the membership agreement.

the_pwner224 7y ago
You can't use a contract to sign away your right to not be enslaved (with the exception of prisoners). Similarly you can't sign away your right to not be illegally held captive by another person. Of course if you leave without allowing Costco to check your bag, they have every right to cancel the contract which was breached. But if they don't let you leave and handcuff you, you have every right to sue them.
- threatofrain 7y ago
  This works at the airports; is there legal clarity or consensus on what kinds of rights you can't give away?
  - reaperducer 7y ago
    Airports are different. They're the property of governments or quangos like airport authorities. There, the people checking you are government employees acting on behalf of the government for the public good. A 17-year-old at Best Buy is only acting on a power trip enabled by his boss, and has zero legal authority to detain you if you're not stealing anything.

Zak 7y ago

> only the police can legally remove the handcuffs at this point. That doesn't sound quite right to me. Do you have a citation?

pessimizer 7y ago

...and 3. 86 you. The proportion of innocent people who will turn down a bag check if it means they can't return to a local retailer I estimate at 0.1%. For any right not to be searched to be meaningful, I'd have to be a right not to habe a search requested of you. Especially since the outcome of refusing a search will likely be a policeman searching you in the parking lot, or on the side of the road during your walk/drive home.

Zak 7y ago
I have refused such a check at Walmart and the result was an employee trying to physically obstruct my exit from the store, accusing me of stealing, and calling me rude names. I left anyway. No cops. No attempt to ban me from the store.