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They should not. All that's left to retail investors are mutual funds and index funds, which can be a decent deal but which also tie the interests of retirees t

They should not. All that's left to retail investors are mutual funds and index funds, which can be a decent deal but which also tie the interests of retirees to the interests of shareholders, which is kind of dumb and fucked up.

javert 7y ago
Why is trying the interests of retirees to shareholders "kind of dumb and fucked up"? I'm not even sure there is a valid distinction between the two groups. The retirees are shareholders.
- bongobongo 7y ago
  Gee, I dunno, maybe think about it for a second. What does a 65 year-old lower middle-class retiree with some money stashed in a 401(k) have in common with an ExxonMobil shareholder aside from the need to generate as much profit as possible? Do you really think this makes sense from a public policy perspective, to pit the retirement needs of the old against, e.g., the environmental health of the young? Please spare me the purely symbolic and utterly meaningless "but they are shareholders, too" argument. Sure. Me and Warren Buffet, we're just the same! It is quite literally dumb and fucked up to tie comfortable retirement to things like releasing carbon into the atmosphere, or defense industry profits, or Wal-Mart's quarterly profits, or to the stability of Jeff Bezos' marriage.
  - lovecg 7y ago
    > Do you really think this makes sense from a public policy perspective, to pit the retirement needs of the old against, e.g., the environmental health of the young? But couldn’t you argue in exactly the same way for disenfranchisement? Do you think retired people should be allowed to vote?
    - harimau777 7y ago
      I think that argument actually supports their point. I believe that everyone has a human right to vote. However, retired people have generally already established themselves; therefore, the changes that government makes, particularly on social issues, has minimal effect on them. Therefore, I think its unfair for the generation who is still establishing themselves not to be held hostage to the previous generation's vision of society.
      - sokoloff 7y ago
        > Therefore, I think [it's] unfair for the generation who is still establishing themselves not to be held hostage to the previous generation's vision of society. I think you have one more negation than you intended in that sentence.
        harimau777 7y ago
        Good catch, my bad
  - bluGill 7y ago
    Retirement funds are the largest shareholder of all. The 65 year old alone isn't much, but all of them combined together are more than any other category of shareholder. Middle class retirement accounts own more stock than the rich.

javert 7y ago

Why is trying the interests of retirees to shareholders "kind of dumb and fucked up"? I'm not even sure there is a valid distinction between the two groups. The retirees are shareholders.

bongobongo 7y ago
Gee, I dunno, maybe think about it for a second. What does a 65 year-old lower middle-class retiree with some money stashed in a 401(k) have in common with an ExxonMobil shareholder aside from the need to generate as much profit as possible? Do you really think this makes sense from a public policy perspective, to pit the retirement needs of the old against, e.g., the environmental health of the young? Please spare me the purely symbolic and utterly meaningless "but they are shareholders, too" argument. Sure. Me and Warren Buffet, we're just the same! It is quite literally dumb and fucked up to tie comfortable retirement to things like releasing carbon into the atmosphere, or defense industry profits, or Wal-Mart's quarterly profits, or to the stability of Jeff Bezos' marriage.
- lovecg 7y ago
  > Do you really think this makes sense from a public policy perspective, to pit the retirement needs of the old against, e.g., the environmental health of the young? But couldn’t you argue in exactly the same way for disenfranchisement? Do you think retired people should be allowed to vote?
  - harimau777 7y ago
    I think that argument actually supports their point. I believe that everyone has a human right to vote. However, retired people have generally already established themselves; therefore, the changes that government makes, particularly on social issues, has minimal effect on them. Therefore, I think its unfair for the generation who is still establishing themselves not to be held hostage to the previous generation's vision of society.
    - sokoloff 7y ago
      > Therefore, I think [it's] unfair for the generation who is still establishing themselves not to be held hostage to the previous generation's vision of society. I think you have one more negation than you intended in that sentence.
      - harimau777 7y ago
        Good catch, my bad
- bluGill 7y ago
  Retirement funds are the largest shareholder of all. The 65 year old alone isn't much, but all of them combined together are more than any other category of shareholder. Middle class retirement accounts own more stock than the rich.