3 ms·

I know you mean well but that attitude is basically equivalent to "be rich enough to pay other people to have the liability or don't bother" in practice.

dllthomas 7y ago
But... people with professional training around managing exactly that kind of liability, at least in theory.
sjg007 7y ago
Umm.. how about we start with, get a permit and adhere to building code and the law.
jessaustin 7y ago
This is the only way this can work. If you want to build and occupy your own construction, that's great. May you only cut the corners that won't result in your own painful death. If you want to pay others to labor under your direction, you have to get that inspected. I say this as someone who does a great deal of unprofessional carpentry, electrical work, mechanical repair, excavation, plumbing, etc. for myself and for family members. I would never have gone willingly into that hole. I certainly would never have asked anyone else to do so. No unexploited worker would have done this work.
- dfeojm-zlib 7y ago
  Reminds me of the underground structures Colin Furze has conjured up: - an underground multi-level beach hut: https://youtu.be/AojTrc_UMaM https://youtu.be/AojTrc_UMaM - apocalypse bunker under his shed: https://youtu.be/KO25JYAaJC0 https://youtu.be/KO25JYAaJC0
- dsfyu404ed 7y ago
  There's a hell of a lot of space between "yeah, that hole is fked but you do you" and "hire someone or GTFO" which is what the comment I initially replied to is advocating for. Property owners should be able to do their own work on their own property or act as their own general contractors. Disallowing that is right up there with gated communities that tell you exactly how tall your grass should be but that's the only way to prevent this kind of thing. I don't think everone's (already highly limited) right do what they want on their own property should be further curtailed because of one bad actor.
  - jessaustin 7y ago
    I had a different reading of parent. It doesn't mean Beckwitt had to hire someone; after all Beckwitt already had decided to hire without any input from us. It means that if you do hire someone for hazardous technical work, hire someone capable of doing that hazardous technical work (which would include the judgment to walk away from unsafe jobs), not some poor clueless guy you can bully. Yes that would have been too expensive for Beckwitt, and he would have never been able to get permits for it. That would have been society functioning correctly.

dllthomas 7y ago

But... people with professional training around managing exactly that kind of liability, at least in theory.

sjg007 7y ago

Umm.. how about we start with, get a permit and adhere to building code and the law.

jessaustin 7y ago

This is the only way this can work. If you want to build and occupy your own construction, that's great. May you only cut the corners that won't result in your own painful death. If you want to pay others to labor under your direction, you have to get that inspected. I say this as someone who does a great deal of unprofessional carpentry, electrical work, mechanical repair, excavation, plumbing, etc. for myself and for family members. I would never have gone willingly into that hole. I certainly would never have asked anyone else to do so. No unexploited worker would have done this work.

dfeojm-zlib 7y ago
Reminds me of the underground structures Colin Furze has conjured up: - an underground multi-level beach hut: https://youtu.be/AojTrc_UMaM https://youtu.be/AojTrc_UMaM - apocalypse bunker under his shed: https://youtu.be/KO25JYAaJC0 https://youtu.be/KO25JYAaJC0
dsfyu404ed 7y ago
There's a hell of a lot of space between "yeah, that hole is fked but you do you" and "hire someone or GTFO" which is what the comment I initially replied to is advocating for. Property owners should be able to do their own work on their own property or act as their own general contractors. Disallowing that is right up there with gated communities that tell you exactly how tall your grass should be but that's the only way to prevent this kind of thing. I don't think everone's (already highly limited) right do what they want on their own property should be further curtailed because of one bad actor.
- jessaustin 7y ago
  I had a different reading of parent. It doesn't mean Beckwitt had to hire someone; after all Beckwitt already had decided to hire without any input from us. It means that if you do hire someone for hazardous technical work, hire someone capable of doing that hazardous technical work (which would include the judgment to walk away from unsafe jobs), not some poor clueless guy you can bully. Yes that would have been too expensive for Beckwitt, and he would have never been able to get permits for it. That would have been society functioning correctly.