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Anyone who looks at regulations like this and sees the Soviet Union is themselves a lunatic. This is not a planned economy, and people do not need to profit fro

Anyone who looks at regulations like this and sees the Soviet Union is themselves a lunatic. This is not a planned economy, and people do not need to profit from housing to build it, and housing should be a human right.

innocentoldguy 7y ago
If you take the monetary incentive of profit away, what other motivator exists for people to take huge financial risks and expend vast amounts of money to purchase land and construct houses and other living structures? I guess you do have the right to wander into the forest and build yourself a fortress out of pine cones and moss, but if you want to live in a modern house with modern amenities, there's going to be a profit incentive behind it. It's basic economics.
- kaybe 7y ago
  > I guess you do have the right to wander into the forest and build yourself a fortress out of pine cones and moss.. Is there anywhere where this would be legal? Certainly not in Germany.
refurb 7y ago
OK, then look at NYC in the 1970's. Severe rent control resulted in crumbling buildings. Price controls are bad policy.
- bpfrh 7y ago
  NYC is in america which has a complete different economic Idea. While Germany was and sometimes still is a social market economy America is a full blown free markt, of course just slapping a rent control and nothing else is a bad idea
  - refurb 7y ago
    America is a full blown free markt NYC? No, it's not a full blown free market by the very fact they have rent control.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
jbullock35 7y ago
> people do not need to profit from housing to build it Yes, I'm sure that you volunteer your services to build new housing all the time.
- rhinoceraptor 7y ago
  Not just your services, you also have to take out a 7 figure loan to invest in the project.
- krastanov 7y ago
  Many of us actually volunteer our services for social good all the time (not construction in my case, but people do that too). This should be celebrated and even expected from people, not met with incredulity and snark. And please do not twist the words of OP. The whole point of a democratic government / social contract (at least on paper) is to have a communal entity deal with this stuff when there are not enough volunteers.
a_c_s 7y ago
> people do not need to profit from housing to build it People do need to profit from something to do it in a capitalist society.
- supergauntlet 7y ago
  Housing is not a market that should be governed by capitalism. I honestly don't care if the ultra-rich trade 30 million dollar homes and speculate on their value, but the fact that homelessness is even a problem in the first world is a travesty. Our children will look back upon a time when there were 6 (SIX!) empty homes for every homeless person in the United States and weep. Obviously those homes aren't all where the homeless people are, but that's another problem itself: Why on earth are developers building homes in the middle of nowhere, why are they building luxury condos, and who the hell is buying them?
  - cheerlessbog 7y ago
    As I understand it, homelessness has more complex causes than simply not having access to affordable housing.
    - supergauntlet 7y ago
      Sure, but the majority of it comes down to "money": https://i.imgur.com/aUvpH0S.png https://i.imgur.com/aUvpH0S.png The fact that we can't solve homelessness "just" by giving everyone easy access to affordable housing isn't an argument against affordable housing. It's an argument for better mental health services and a wider safety net.
      - tathougies 7y ago
        The count in that graph also includes people living in temporary, public shelters. In my opinion, that makes it slightly less useful when attempting to determine the cause of people on the streets, which is what most people refer to as homelessness. It does seem silly to me to include those living in currently available public housing as 'homeless'. It's perfectly possible that most of those who lost jobs are currently housed in existing public options, and the majority of those on the streets are there due to addiction. Unfortunately, I couldn't find a breakdown of self-reported reasons for homelessness once those already sheltered were removed. Source: http://allhomekc.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/2019-Report_KingCounty_FINAL.pdf http://allhomekc.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/2019-Report_..., Methodology Section, point 3, saying they include those living in shelters.
codedokode 7y ago
Nice idea. Can I have a free apartment in the centre of Moscow within 5 minutes walk from subway then? What I want to say is that houses are different and there are places where everybody wants to live and where nobody wants, and that is why the housing prices can be so high. Maybe instead of asking for a fixed rent people should consider a cheaper place to live? Everybody cannot live within 5 minutes from a subway station.
- SomeOldThrow 7y ago
  The answer is just a google away! I’m guessing you know nothing about social housing based on this comment.
tathougies 7y ago
> This is not a planned economy, and people do not need to profit from housing to build it Can you explain? Even if I were to build my own house, I would myself profit because the enjoyment I got out of the new house would be greater than the enjoyment I'd have had without it, thus my 'profit' is the cost of the enjoyment of my new shelter.

innocentoldguy 7y ago

If you take the monetary incentive of profit away, what other motivator exists for people to take huge financial risks and expend vast amounts of money to purchase land and construct houses and other living structures? I guess you do have the right to wander into the forest and build yourself a fortress out of pine cones and moss, but if you want to live in a modern house with modern amenities, there's going to be a profit incentive behind it. It's basic economics.

kaybe 7y ago
> I guess you do have the right to wander into the forest and build yourself a fortress out of pine cones and moss.. Is there anywhere where this would be legal? Certainly not in Germany.

refurb 7y ago

OK, then look at NYC in the 1970's. Severe rent control resulted in crumbling buildings. Price controls are bad policy.

bpfrh 7y ago
NYC is in america which has a complete different economic Idea. While Germany was and sometimes still is a social market economy America is a full blown free markt, of course just slapping a rent control and nothing else is a bad idea
- refurb 7y ago
  America is a full blown free markt NYC? No, it's not a full blown free market by the very fact they have rent control.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

jbullock35 7y ago

> people do not need to profit from housing to build it Yes, I'm sure that you volunteer your services to build new housing all the time.

rhinoceraptor 7y ago
Not just your services, you also have to take out a 7 figure loan to invest in the project.
krastanov 7y ago
Many of us actually volunteer our services for social good all the time (not construction in my case, but people do that too). This should be celebrated and even expected from people, not met with incredulity and snark. And please do not twist the words of OP. The whole point of a democratic government / social contract (at least on paper) is to have a communal entity deal with this stuff when there are not enough volunteers.

a_c_s 7y ago

> people do not need to profit from housing to build it People do need to profit from something to do it in a capitalist society.

supergauntlet 7y ago
Housing is not a market that should be governed by capitalism. I honestly don't care if the ultra-rich trade 30 million dollar homes and speculate on their value, but the fact that homelessness is even a problem in the first world is a travesty. Our children will look back upon a time when there were 6 (SIX!) empty homes for every homeless person in the United States and weep. Obviously those homes aren't all where the homeless people are, but that's another problem itself: Why on earth are developers building homes in the middle of nowhere, why are they building luxury condos, and who the hell is buying them?
- cheerlessbog 7y ago
  As I understand it, homelessness has more complex causes than simply not having access to affordable housing.
  - supergauntlet 7y ago
    Sure, but the majority of it comes down to "money": https://i.imgur.com/aUvpH0S.png https://i.imgur.com/aUvpH0S.png The fact that we can't solve homelessness "just" by giving everyone easy access to affordable housing isn't an argument against affordable housing. It's an argument for better mental health services and a wider safety net.
    - tathougies 7y ago
      The count in that graph also includes people living in temporary, public shelters. In my opinion, that makes it slightly less useful when attempting to determine the cause of people on the streets, which is what most people refer to as homelessness. It does seem silly to me to include those living in currently available public housing as 'homeless'. It's perfectly possible that most of those who lost jobs are currently housed in existing public options, and the majority of those on the streets are there due to addiction. Unfortunately, I couldn't find a breakdown of self-reported reasons for homelessness once those already sheltered were removed. Source: http://allhomekc.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/2019-Report_KingCounty_FINAL.pdf http://allhomekc.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/2019-Report_..., Methodology Section, point 3, saying they include those living in shelters.

codedokode 7y ago

Nice idea. Can I have a free apartment in the centre of Moscow within 5 minutes walk from subway then? What I want to say is that houses are different and there are places where everybody wants to live and where nobody wants, and that is why the housing prices can be so high. Maybe instead of asking for a fixed rent people should consider a cheaper place to live? Everybody cannot live within 5 minutes from a subway station.

SomeOldThrow 7y ago
The answer is just a google away! I’m guessing you know nothing about social housing based on this comment.

tathougies 7y ago

> This is not a planned economy, and people do not need to profit from housing to build it Can you explain? Even if I were to build my own house, I would myself profit because the enjoyment I got out of the new house would be greater than the enjoyment I'd have had without it, thus my 'profit' is the cost of the enjoyment of my new shelter.