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Capitalism never ended slavery, it has actually prolonged it. The constitution expressly includes an exception for slavery: if one has been convicted of a crime

Capitalism never ended slavery, it has actually prolonged it. The constitution expressly includes an exception for slavery: if one has been convicted of a crime. This has led to the prison-industrial complex. [0] Guess what demographic is disproportionately represented in these prisons? [1] [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison%E2%80%93industrial_complex https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison%E2%80%93industrial_comp... [1]: "African Americans are incarcerated at more than 5 times the rate of whites." (https://www.naacp.org/criminal-justice-fact-sheet/ https://www.naacp.org/criminal-justice-fact-sheet/)

masonic 7y ago
There is no civilian prison in which hard labor is required in the USA. (Courts-martial sentences could include hard labor; not sure if that is used anymore.)
- cooper12 7y ago
  That's like saying child labor was never mandatory. If labor is your only possible source of income, [0] and there are heavy incentives to perform labor, then people will perform labor. It being voluntary does not change the fact that it is heavily coercive (especially when your work pool has the lowest legal rights within the citizenry—a similar situation with child rights in the past). [0]: And if you don't have money, you cannot access the commissary nor even make a simple phone call.
  - masonic 7y ago
    And if you don't have money, you cannot access the commissary nor even make a simple phone call. Anybody on the outside can contribute to your commissary account... Presumably, the one with whom you plan to converse.
abstract7 7y ago
Capitalism absolutely ended Slavery, and the Civil War. Eli Whitney's cotton gin and interchangeable factory made parts made it economical to produce cotton with far less labor. Capitalism did that. Serfdom and slavery isn't capitalism. You're wrong about America and the reason for incacerarion. The African American murder rate is 8 times the rate of whites and other violent crime is thereabouts. https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/htus8008.pdf https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/htus8008.pdf It it is obviously because of social policy directed towards African Americans. Their murder rates skyrocketed mostly after the 1960s. And half my American family is black and none are incarcerated; lots of high ranking police, highly-decorated soldiers, and educators.
- cooper12 7y ago
  Again, slavery was never completely abolished: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirteenth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution#Penal_labor_exemption https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirteenth_Amendment_to_the_Un.... The industrial complex is how it's capitalism: because there's a profit motive for private prisons to obtain inmates. And not sure why you've decided to zero in on murder rates, as if everyone in prison is a convicted murderer. I also don't see how your family is relevant, as you can't extrapolate from that.
  - abstract7 7y ago
    I zeroed on murder rates to bring home the point that higher rates of really serious crime, not just drug related that some think is trivial, is a relatively larger problem in the African American community than average. Some falsely believe that African Americans are incarcerated at a higher rate purely because of marijuana, minor drug possession, or re-arrests in prison. Only a small fraction of the African American community is actually incarcerated. However, it's still at a much higher rate than normal. It's not slavery. So me bringing up my family is to demonstrate that not all African American families struggle w/incarceration. Context. And I'm not a fan or private prisons. So we agree on that. Profit motive pre-dates capitalism. Arab slave traders in the 18th century weren't capitalist by any stretch. 16th century BC slavery in North Africa Egypt had nothing to do with capitalism. So you're confusing profit seeking, which has always existed, with capitalism. The fact is that slavery was mainstream for thousands of years before Southern Democrat slavery. It's not a coincidence that within 70 years of the invention of the Eli Whitney cotton gin that slavery ended in the West all together. Cotton production multiplied. Capitalism ended slavery in the West, with the Civil War serving as the nail in the coffin. Furthermore, slavery was only a real big thing because of agrarianism before mechanization. Capitalism mechanized (e.g. cotton gin) the world in the industrial revolution. And if you care about slavery, you may want to direct your attention to Libya were there are actual African slave auctions. Or if you care about unjust incarceration, I'd direct criticism at China for imprisoning large swaths of their Muslim population for simply being Muslim. The fact is that African Americans are the wealthiest of African descendants per capita among any nation. And there are more millionaires of African descent in the United States than anywhere else. There are much higher rates of African American incarceration because they commit that much more crime. The reasons are not genetic but because of social policy that has resulted in 70% rates of single-parent homes in the African American community. FYI my African American half of the relatives are mostly married families. And none are in prison. Context.

masonic 7y ago

There is no civilian prison in which hard labor is required in the USA. (Courts-martial sentences could include hard labor; not sure if that is used anymore.)

cooper12 7y ago
That's like saying child labor was never mandatory. If labor is your only possible source of income, [0] and there are heavy incentives to perform labor, then people will perform labor. It being voluntary does not change the fact that it is heavily coercive (especially when your work pool has the lowest legal rights within the citizenry—a similar situation with child rights in the past). [0]: And if you don't have money, you cannot access the commissary nor even make a simple phone call.
- masonic 7y ago
  And if you don't have money, you cannot access the commissary nor even make a simple phone call. Anybody on the outside can contribute to your commissary account... Presumably, the one with whom you plan to converse.

abstract7 7y ago

Capitalism absolutely ended Slavery, and the Civil War. Eli Whitney's cotton gin and interchangeable factory made parts made it economical to produce cotton with far less labor. Capitalism did that. Serfdom and slavery isn't capitalism. You're wrong about America and the reason for incacerarion. The African American murder rate is 8 times the rate of whites and other violent crime is thereabouts. https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/htus8008.pdf https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/htus8008.pdf It it is obviously because of social policy directed towards African Americans. Their murder rates skyrocketed mostly after the 1960s. And half my American family is black and none are incarcerated; lots of high ranking police, highly-decorated soldiers, and educators.

cooper12 7y ago
Again, slavery was never completely abolished: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirteenth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution#Penal_labor_exemption https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirteenth_Amendment_to_the_Un.... The industrial complex is how it's capitalism: because there's a profit motive for private prisons to obtain inmates. And not sure why you've decided to zero in on murder rates, as if everyone in prison is a convicted murderer. I also don't see how your family is relevant, as you can't extrapolate from that.
- abstract7 7y ago
  I zeroed on murder rates to bring home the point that higher rates of really serious crime, not just drug related that some think is trivial, is a relatively larger problem in the African American community than average. Some falsely believe that African Americans are incarcerated at a higher rate purely because of marijuana, minor drug possession, or re-arrests in prison. Only a small fraction of the African American community is actually incarcerated. However, it's still at a much higher rate than normal. It's not slavery. So me bringing up my family is to demonstrate that not all African American families struggle w/incarceration. Context. And I'm not a fan or private prisons. So we agree on that. Profit motive pre-dates capitalism. Arab slave traders in the 18th century weren't capitalist by any stretch. 16th century BC slavery in North Africa Egypt had nothing to do with capitalism. So you're confusing profit seeking, which has always existed, with capitalism. The fact is that slavery was mainstream for thousands of years before Southern Democrat slavery. It's not a coincidence that within 70 years of the invention of the Eli Whitney cotton gin that slavery ended in the West all together. Cotton production multiplied. Capitalism ended slavery in the West, with the Civil War serving as the nail in the coffin. Furthermore, slavery was only a real big thing because of agrarianism before mechanization. Capitalism mechanized (e.g. cotton gin) the world in the industrial revolution. And if you care about slavery, you may want to direct your attention to Libya were there are actual African slave auctions. Or if you care about unjust incarceration, I'd direct criticism at China for imprisoning large swaths of their Muslim population for simply being Muslim. The fact is that African Americans are the wealthiest of African descendants per capita among any nation. And there are more millionaires of African descent in the United States than anywhere else. There are much higher rates of African American incarceration because they commit that much more crime. The reasons are not genetic but because of social policy that has resulted in 70% rates of single-parent homes in the African American community. FYI my African American half of the relatives are mostly married families. And none are in prison. Context.