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This is the same with other creative works. Visual artists work that gains value is highly correlated with their network to begin with. Right school, right ga

This is the same with other creative works. Visual artists work that gains value is highly correlated with their network to begin with. Right school, right galleries, never ever being seen in a lesser gallery. It makes me sad when an artist who wants to monetize is celebrating the mere fact of being on display as validation, when that very act is undermining the value of their work forever. Is the alternative of being in a prestigious gallery achievable for them? Probably not, and they should consider resigning to that reality if their time is valuable. I think this is not known because when I listen to many talented and aspiring artists the things they value are so at odds with the things that would make them valuable. Things like "I never had formal education" being a bragging point to an aspiring artist not being aware thats not a bragging point to the people that the artist wants to assign value to their work.

deleted 7y ago
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Firadeoclus 7y ago
> It makes me sad when an artist who wants to monetize is celebrating the mere fact of being on display as validation, when that very act is undermining the value of their work forever. Is the alternative of being in a prestigious gallery achievable for them? Probably not, and they should consider resigning to that reality if their time is valuable. If they accept that the alternative is not achievable then being on display in a "lesser gallery" is as good as it gets. So why shouldn't they celebrate? There's room for successful-but-no-superstar artists.
- rolltiide 7y ago
  > If they accept that the alternative is not achievable then being on display in a "lesser gallery" is as good as it gets. So why shouldn't they celebrate? There's room for successful-but-no-superstar artists. Again, I don't think many aspiring artists are aware. They focus on mastery of a craft and also want to make money. They feel that these things are correlated. They aren't.
whatshisface 7y ago
>the things they value are so at odds with the things that would make them valuable If the market price is the value to everybody, then a $100,000 spare part for some random industrial equipment is worth $100,000 to me. But, somehow, I clearly wouldn't spend that much to buy it. The market price isn't the value that everybody agrees on, it's the equilibrium between buyers who decide not to buy it and sellers who decide not to sell it. Yes, to a certain group of people stuff in that New York gallery is worth a lot, but so is that spare part. Manufacturing it might be a good job but nobody goes in to art looking for a good job.
- rolltiide 7y ago
  the market price isn't the value to everybody, its the value in the last transaction in more efficient markets you can weigh it by volume (VWAP), art is not an efficient market
notfromhere 7y ago
You've demonstrated pretty well that the value of art is extremely arbitrary.
- rolltiide 7y ago
  Too broad of a statement, there are buckets. In the lower value bucket, they typically have a trade or product with no scarcity, and no market. They try to sell based on a multiple of their effort. This is everything under $1,000. Prices adjust based on volume sold and desperation of the artist, by artist. So therefore yes prices are more arbitrary at the beginning of an artist's career, and at an art show there would be no rhyme or reason between artists. Perhaps some competition and a race to the bottom at a bazaar. This is the same as pretty much any other trade or contractor that is always testing their market. These artists aspire to be in higher tiers, but largely don't act like they understand what drives the value in those tiers. If they do understand and realize they aren't eligible either way but still spend their time on trying to monetize art, then that is a good objective lens. People with other marketable skills will just resign their art to a pasttime and forget about the monetization goals. In the middle value bucket, it is mostly fine art with low worth, and a very different market. The market forces to create the arbitrary prices are different and mostly correlated to the artist's network when they were alive. Typically there is something undermining the scarcity of these works, but that can also be just demand. Galleries arbitrarily raise the prices over time until a private seller undercuts them. In the high value bucket, it is mostly fine art with high worth. The market forces to create the arbitrary prices are different and mostly correlated to the artist's network when they were alive. Here it is rarely about the aesthetics or the discipline involved in a piece, but the eligibility of a piece even appearing in this market is again based on the artist's network while they were living. Most of the high value bucket is a product of monetary policy and there are whole books about it.

deleted 7y ago

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Firadeoclus 7y ago

> It makes me sad when an artist who wants to monetize is celebrating the mere fact of being on display as validation, when that very act is undermining the value of their work forever. Is the alternative of being in a prestigious gallery achievable for them? Probably not, and they should consider resigning to that reality if their time is valuable. If they accept that the alternative is not achievable then being on display in a "lesser gallery" is as good as it gets. So why shouldn't they celebrate? There's room for successful-but-no-superstar artists.

rolltiide 7y ago
> If they accept that the alternative is not achievable then being on display in a "lesser gallery" is as good as it gets. So why shouldn't they celebrate? There's room for successful-but-no-superstar artists. Again, I don't think many aspiring artists are aware. They focus on mastery of a craft and also want to make money. They feel that these things are correlated. They aren't.

whatshisface 7y ago

>the things they value are so at odds with the things that would make them valuable If the market price is the value to everybody, then a $100,000 spare part for some random industrial equipment is worth $100,000 to me. But, somehow, I clearly wouldn't spend that much to buy it. The market price isn't the value that everybody agrees on, it's the equilibrium between buyers who decide not to buy it and sellers who decide not to sell it. Yes, to a certain group of people stuff in that New York gallery is worth a lot, but so is that spare part. Manufacturing it might be a good job but nobody goes in to art looking for a good job.

rolltiide 7y ago
the market price isn't the value to everybody, its the value in the last transaction in more efficient markets you can weigh it by volume (VWAP), art is not an efficient market

notfromhere 7y ago

You've demonstrated pretty well that the value of art is extremely arbitrary.

rolltiide 7y ago
Too broad of a statement, there are buckets. In the lower value bucket, they typically have a trade or product with no scarcity, and no market. They try to sell based on a multiple of their effort. This is everything under $1,000. Prices adjust based on volume sold and desperation of the artist, by artist. So therefore yes prices are more arbitrary at the beginning of an artist's career, and at an art show there would be no rhyme or reason between artists. Perhaps some competition and a race to the bottom at a bazaar. This is the same as pretty much any other trade or contractor that is always testing their market. These artists aspire to be in higher tiers, but largely don't act like they understand what drives the value in those tiers. If they do understand and realize they aren't eligible either way but still spend their time on trying to monetize art, then that is a good objective lens. People with other marketable skills will just resign their art to a pasttime and forget about the monetization goals. In the middle value bucket, it is mostly fine art with low worth, and a very different market. The market forces to create the arbitrary prices are different and mostly correlated to the artist's network when they were alive. Typically there is something undermining the scarcity of these works, but that can also be just demand. Galleries arbitrarily raise the prices over time until a private seller undercuts them. In the high value bucket, it is mostly fine art with high worth. The market forces to create the arbitrary prices are different and mostly correlated to the artist's network when they were alive. Here it is rarely about the aesthetics or the discipline involved in a piece, but the eligibility of a piece even appearing in this market is again based on the artist's network while they were living. Most of the high value bucket is a product of monetary policy and there are whole books about it.