6 ms·

This is perhaps the most poignant comment in the article: "CERN has enjoyed special conditions for the use of Microsoft products for the last 20 years, by virt

by carwyn 7y ago

This is perhaps the most poignant comment in the article: "CERN has enjoyed special conditions for the use of Microsoft products for the last 20 years, by virtue of its status as an “academic institution”. However, recently, the company has decided to revoke CERN’s academic status, a measure that took effect at the end of the previous contract in March 2019, replaced by a new contract based on user numbers, increasing the license costs by more than a factor of ten."

BlueTemplar 7y ago
Reminds me of the recent Google Maps price increase. My nearly million-people town's public transport route planning software has had frequent outages since...
- asark 7y ago
  If there's one widely used Internet or Web service that seems like it really ought to be run by the government, it's mapping and routing. It's kinda infrastructure, governments have or should have the info already, and there's not much benefit to having multiple projects handling it. The data and basic API should at least come from a government source, I'd say. Let companies but whatever sugar they want on top of that (streetview, say).
  - jedimastert 7y ago
    It's not really run IRL though, or at least the US government isn't putting out official atlases (I don't think?)
    - HillRat 7y ago
      The Census Bureau’s TIGER/Line is the authoritative repository of US streets and features data, regularly updated by municipalities and counties. For-profit mapping services augment the data and use drivers to make sure they’re on top of streets changes, but you can do a great deal of work with just Census and municipal GIS data.
      - mixmastamyk 7y ago
        Used Tiger as my first online map in the mid 90s, thanks for the blast from the past. Probably found it thru "Cool site of the day."
      - Somasis 7y ago
        TIGER's great, but if you're going to use it you might as well just use OpenStreetMap in the end; a lot of the data in the US is based on TIGER data and then reviewed, as TIGER has had a lot of issues with things like misnamed roads and misalignments of roads.
    - throwaway2048 7y ago
      The United States Geological Survey releases tons of mapping data.
  - syshum 7y ago
    IN the US there are multiple government programs that are suppose to Track GIS data including Roads, however like with all things government it is very expensive, inefficient, and of low to poor accuracy. There are entire teams of people in the OpenStreetMaps project dedicated to fixing the inaccuracies of these government databases This is why google spends m/billions having people physically drive the roads and walk around cities (and to get live photos) I never really understand why people want government to take over things, in the history of government there is never been a well run, properly executed, highly efficient service. Government by it very nature is incapable of producing good services
    - maxerickson 7y ago
      OpenStreetMap imported a bunch of US data while Census was in the middle of a project to improve the quality of their data. The stuff that had been improved is pretty good. The stuff that hadn't been improved isn't tracking the current version of the government data, it's from 2007 or whatever.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
    - mattkrause 7y ago
      Nonsense. The CDC does a fantastic job keeping tabs on diseases. The FAA has made air travel ridiculously safe. NOAA and NASA produce accurate forecasts of weather and tides. The National Parks are gems. GPS is absolutely amazing.
  - mises 7y ago
    Do you really want to see your nice, clean google maps application replaced by committee-designed garbage? Besides, where in the Constitution does it say that's allowed? The only reason GPS turned out as well as it did was because it was a military service opened to the public.
    - foota 7y ago
      What? The constitution doesn't have to explicitly allow something. And your argument for GPS turning out well would seem to be an argument in favor of government controlled systems working well?
      - syshum 7y ago
        >>>The constitution doesn't have to explicitly allow something Yes it actually does, if the Constitution does not Grant the power to the Government then that power is Reserved for the States and the people We have forgotten what the constitution is, it is a document outlines what the government is allowed to do, everything else is suppose to be forbidden. Instead somehow over the last 200 years a few of the vague parts of the constitution have be misinterpreted (the commerce clause as an exampled) to give the federal government near unlimited power
        foota 7y ago
        Honestly? I don't really care what the constitution says, I think it makes way more sense for our government to have a blacklist of laws they can pass rather than a whitelist. That said though, I acknowledge that you're right. Fortunately for me, the courts seem to disagree :-)
        syshum 7y ago
        It only makes sense if you support Authoritarian governments and oppose liberty for individuals Granting the government unlimited authority then "blacklisting" only come things is a recipe for abuse, which is what we have today if you are a person that believes in individualist freedoms it is a fundamental difference as to who is the master and who is the servant, you believe the people are subverted to the government. I believe like our founders that We the people are the masters, I believe in self-governance, I believe in Self Ownership, I believe in liberty. it is sad we as a society has lost respect for indivualism and liberty
  - moksly 7y ago
    It kind of already is, but there isn't a coordinated global effort of any kind. Every GIS department has an unbelievable amount of mapping information. Because we need to, and because a lot of governments, especially in Europe, it's illegal for us to rely on google because they track too much. Some of the data is private, and rightly so, as it contains detailed private informations of properties used for internal BI. In Skanderborg Kommune of Denmark, the GIS department has even started running it's own street-view feature. But again, that's just a tiny piece of the total area of Denmark and neighboring cities might do things completely different. We do have national initiatives like opendata.dk, that tries to extend APIs for all this data, but that's still just on a national level. I think open street map should really be the "google maps" option exactly because it's both open and global, and I do think the public sector should put as much of it's data into it as possible, but I have no idea how we should fund it.
    - toomuchtodo 7y ago
      > but I have no idea how we should fund it. Grants from government bodies, with governance and stakeholders in the non-profit that operates OSM. Once that is in place, it becomes straightforward for governments and other contributors to treat OSM as the canonical Source Of GIS Truth.
  - _pmf_ 7y ago
    And it piggybacks from an operational standpoint on GPS, so currently the private service leverages the public one.
  - nerd7473 7y ago
    I agree with you there. It's an important service that was orginally created by the military (though I'm not sure which one).

by carwyn 7y ago

BlueTemplar 7y ago

Reminds me of the recent Google Maps price increase. My nearly million-people town's public transport route planning software has had frequent outages since...

asark 7y ago
If there's one widely used Internet or Web service that seems like it really ought to be run by the government, it's mapping and routing. It's kinda infrastructure, governments have or should have the info already, and there's not much benefit to having multiple projects handling it. The data and basic API should at least come from a government source, I'd say. Let companies but whatever sugar they want on top of that (streetview, say).
- jedimastert 7y ago
  It's not really run IRL though, or at least the US government isn't putting out official atlases (I don't think?)
  - HillRat 7y ago
    The Census Bureau’s TIGER/Line is the authoritative repository of US streets and features data, regularly updated by municipalities and counties. For-profit mapping services augment the data and use drivers to make sure they’re on top of streets changes, but you can do a great deal of work with just Census and municipal GIS data.
    - mixmastamyk 7y ago
      Used Tiger as my first online map in the mid 90s, thanks for the blast from the past. Probably found it thru "Cool site of the day."
    - Somasis 7y ago
      TIGER's great, but if you're going to use it you might as well just use OpenStreetMap in the end; a lot of the data in the US is based on TIGER data and then reviewed, as TIGER has had a lot of issues with things like misnamed roads and misalignments of roads.
  - throwaway2048 7y ago
    The United States Geological Survey releases tons of mapping data.
- syshum 7y ago
  IN the US there are multiple government programs that are suppose to Track GIS data including Roads, however like with all things government it is very expensive, inefficient, and of low to poor accuracy. There are entire teams of people in the OpenStreetMaps project dedicated to fixing the inaccuracies of these government databases This is why google spends m/billions having people physically drive the roads and walk around cities (and to get live photos) I never really understand why people want government to take over things, in the history of government there is never been a well run, properly executed, highly efficient service. Government by it very nature is incapable of producing good services
  - maxerickson 7y ago
    OpenStreetMap imported a bunch of US data while Census was in the middle of a project to improve the quality of their data. The stuff that had been improved is pretty good. The stuff that hadn't been improved isn't tracking the current version of the government data, it's from 2007 or whatever.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - mattkrause 7y ago
    Nonsense. The CDC does a fantastic job keeping tabs on diseases. The FAA has made air travel ridiculously safe. NOAA and NASA produce accurate forecasts of weather and tides. The National Parks are gems. GPS is absolutely amazing.
- mises 7y ago
  Do you really want to see your nice, clean google maps application replaced by committee-designed garbage? Besides, where in the Constitution does it say that's allowed? The only reason GPS turned out as well as it did was because it was a military service opened to the public.
  - foota 7y ago
    What? The constitution doesn't have to explicitly allow something. And your argument for GPS turning out well would seem to be an argument in favor of government controlled systems working well?
    - syshum 7y ago
      >>>The constitution doesn't have to explicitly allow something Yes it actually does, if the Constitution does not Grant the power to the Government then that power is Reserved for the States and the people We have forgotten what the constitution is, it is a document outlines what the government is allowed to do, everything else is suppose to be forbidden. Instead somehow over the last 200 years a few of the vague parts of the constitution have be misinterpreted (the commerce clause as an exampled) to give the federal government near unlimited power
      - foota 7y ago
        Honestly? I don't really care what the constitution says, I think it makes way more sense for our government to have a blacklist of laws they can pass rather than a whitelist. That said though, I acknowledge that you're right. Fortunately for me, the courts seem to disagree :-)
        syshum 7y ago
        It only makes sense if you support Authoritarian governments and oppose liberty for individuals Granting the government unlimited authority then "blacklisting" only come things is a recipe for abuse, which is what we have today if you are a person that believes in individualist freedoms it is a fundamental difference as to who is the master and who is the servant, you believe the people are subverted to the government. I believe like our founders that We the people are the masters, I believe in self-governance, I believe in Self Ownership, I believe in liberty. it is sad we as a society has lost respect for indivualism and liberty
- moksly 7y ago
  It kind of already is, but there isn't a coordinated global effort of any kind. Every GIS department has an unbelievable amount of mapping information. Because we need to, and because a lot of governments, especially in Europe, it's illegal for us to rely on google because they track too much. Some of the data is private, and rightly so, as it contains detailed private informations of properties used for internal BI. In Skanderborg Kommune of Denmark, the GIS department has even started running it's own street-view feature. But again, that's just a tiny piece of the total area of Denmark and neighboring cities might do things completely different. We do have national initiatives like opendata.dk, that tries to extend APIs for all this data, but that's still just on a national level. I think open street map should really be the "google maps" option exactly because it's both open and global, and I do think the public sector should put as much of it's data into it as possible, but I have no idea how we should fund it.
  - toomuchtodo 7y ago
    > but I have no idea how we should fund it. Grants from government bodies, with governance and stakeholders in the non-profit that operates OSM. Once that is in place, it becomes straightforward for governments and other contributors to treat OSM as the canonical Source Of GIS Truth.
- _pmf_ 7y ago
  And it piggybacks from an operational standpoint on GPS, so currently the private service leverages the public one.
- nerd7473 7y ago
  I agree with you there. It's an important service that was orginally created by the military (though I'm not sure which one).