3 ms·

>My opinion about supporting Make Media changed after the RealSexyCyborg incident in the winter of 2017: Thanks, the damage was and is pretty bad- and long-las

>My opinion about supporting Make Media changed after the RealSexyCyborg incident in the winter of 2017: Thanks, the damage was and is pretty bad- and long-lasting. But, "be like water" and all that. I'm slowly pivoting to hardware development. Studying welding and CNC operations now also. But- as far as business dealings with Make my one direct experience, in an area I'm qualified to talk about is that their China strategy was simply awful. Just textbook how to fail in China. They chose a Chinese partner that did not understand Maker culture, was incentivized to not support it (even curtail it), and let them run the Make brand into the ground during a time when billions of RMB was going into Maker initiatives: https://theasiadialogue.com/2016/05/26/makerspaces-for-the-people-chinas-approach-to-cultivating-an-entrepreneurial-mindset/ https://theasiadialogue.com/2016/05/26/makerspaces-for-the-p... Not just government grants, but parents willing to pay generously for after-school hands-on activities that cultivate creativity. Lego absolutely nailed it, they were and are the model for Make to follow: https://www.scmp.com/business/companies/article/2188280/brick-brick-store-store-danish-toymaker-lego-builds-its-empire https://www.scmp.com/business/companies/article/2188280/bric... I told Make all this last year. Even with all the shit they pulled- I want Chinese kids to have something better than factory jobs making shanzhai shit. I will talk to Make or anyone else if it means more creativity here. I am a true believer- I would make a lot more doing literally anything else if I wasn't. I offered to get Make legal representation, connect them with the investors that were asking for an introduction- just at least hear them out. Nope. Patronizing and dismissive. They were convinced their current Chinese partner had "lots of guanxi" and had it all figured out. It was a huge, huge missed opportunity for absolutely no reason at the absolute height of demand. Now, of course, the Maker market has cooled off: http://www.sixthtone.com/news/1003171/made-in-china-the-boom-and-bust-of-makerspaces http://www.sixthtone.com/news/1003171/made-in-china-the-boom... and things would be much harder. Make seems to make very bad business decisions, driven by enforcing an in-house ideology and social hierarchy that really has no relation to the Hacker ethic at the heart of the Maker movement.

erk__ 7y ago
There are few companies I look up to as much as LEGO, they had a bad financial time in the 0's, where they had to sadly sell off the parks. But now they have really found what makes them special again. Including expanding to new markets like China. It came as a pretty big surprise for me that they got some Lepin factories closed down and raided by the Chinese authorities. They are as you say a good example of a company that knows how to work in China.
- SexyCyborg 7y ago
  >It came as a pretty big surprise for me that they got some Lepin factories closed down and raided by the Chinese authorities. They are as you say a good example of a company that knows how to work in China. This is becoming more and more common. Adafruit is another example, really good IP protection in China so no one has knocked off their boards. I have a Chinese IP lawyer I recommend who is great at this, but unfortunately most foreigners feel American IP protection is sufficient so won't spend the little bit it takes to protect themselves (better) in China.
  - burnsideb 7y ago
    > Adafruit is another example, really good IP protection in China so no one has knocked off their boards. Could you please (briefly) elaborate on these protections or point me in the right direction to look, ie articles and/or search terms? I mean absolutely no disrespect but as a westerner without any real knowledge of China I only know the stereotype of China being like the wild west where everything gets ripped off. I'm happy to do some research to learn more about it if you could advice me where to look!
    - SexyCyborg 7y ago
      >I mean absolutely no disrespect but as a westerner without any real knowledge of China I only know the stereotype of China being like the wild west where everything gets ripped off. I'm happy to do some research to learn more about it if you could advice me where to look! No offense taken! It seems crazy but things change fast- and yes we still steal loads of stuff and tend not to respect IP not registered in China. I have not found a really good write up in English, I've been meaning to get together with some local friends and do something. But yeah- totally ok to be skeptical, we don't have a stellar track record
  - linker3000 7y ago
    I have a couple of really poor Adafruit knockoff I2C PWM expander boards from a couple of years back (Aliexpress seller). The logo/silkscreen is rough, there's a PCB trace missing and the power LED resistor value is too low so the light was blinding until I replaced the resistor. Maybe the situation has changed?
baybal2 7y ago
The whole "maker" seem to have long been appropriated: There is an event going on https://imgur.com/a/5w3P8l4 https://imgur.com/a/5w3P8l4 Shenzhen maker week has no relation to maker fare, but it seem to have surely overtaken it
justinclift 7y ago
> Studying welding and CNC operations now also. Muaa Haaa Haaa. Good stuff. CNC is awesome. :) Seems to turn into a huge (fun) time sink, but expands out the possibilities for creating things. Looking at your video list on YouTube quickly, it seems like good initial learning: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkmVH8knK60 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkmVH8knK60 If/when you're up for a more full-on CNC system - without getting crazy expensive - the Shapeoko 3 is very, very good: * https://community.carbide3d.com/t/hardcore-aluminum-milling-on-an-s3/9744 https://community.carbide3d.com/t/hardcore-aluminum-milling-... <-- stuff done by someone who really knows what they're doing (not me ;>) * https://carbide3d.com/shapeoko/ https://carbide3d.com/shapeoko/ Personally, I started with 3D printing too (FlashForge Creator Pro), and moved into CNC after hitting frustrating limitations with that. Haven't gotten into welding yet (it's on the ToDo list), as no backyard or shed here to do it in. Ugh. :/ In theory, I should be able to find a Maker type place nearby, but haven't investigated that yet. Any idea if there's an equivalent to the Shapeoko in Shenzhen? eg high quality, but low cost So far, all I've seen online is the same cheapo stuff (low quality, low cost) that appears in any kind of Ebay search for CNC. o_O
inflatableDodo 7y ago
>Thanks, the damage was and is pretty bad- and long-lasting. But, "be like water" and all that. I'm slowly pivoting to hardware development. Studying welding and CNC operations now also. Keep at it, you are setting an amazing example here. Very good luck with it all. edit - if you are pivoting to hardware development, get one of these; http://www.latticesemi.com/en/Products/DevelopmentBoardsAndKits/iCE40HX8KBreakoutBoard.aspx http://www.latticesemi.com/en/Products/DevelopmentBoardsAndK... use this on it; http://www.clifford.at/icestorm/ http://www.clifford.at/icestorm/ and this is where you can find some useful modules - https://opencores.org/ https://opencores.org/ Is some of the most fun I have had in ages in making tech do weird shit. I currently have a stepper motor rumnning over optic fibre as the first stage of my new 3d printer build.

erk__ 7y ago

There are few companies I look up to as much as LEGO, they had a bad financial time in the 0's, where they had to sadly sell off the parks. But now they have really found what makes them special again. Including expanding to new markets like China. It came as a pretty big surprise for me that they got some Lepin factories closed down and raided by the Chinese authorities. They are as you say a good example of a company that knows how to work in China.

SexyCyborg 7y ago
>It came as a pretty big surprise for me that they got some Lepin factories closed down and raided by the Chinese authorities. They are as you say a good example of a company that knows how to work in China. This is becoming more and more common. Adafruit is another example, really good IP protection in China so no one has knocked off their boards. I have a Chinese IP lawyer I recommend who is great at this, but unfortunately most foreigners feel American IP protection is sufficient so won't spend the little bit it takes to protect themselves (better) in China.
- burnsideb 7y ago
  > Adafruit is another example, really good IP protection in China so no one has knocked off their boards. Could you please (briefly) elaborate on these protections or point me in the right direction to look, ie articles and/or search terms? I mean absolutely no disrespect but as a westerner without any real knowledge of China I only know the stereotype of China being like the wild west where everything gets ripped off. I'm happy to do some research to learn more about it if you could advice me where to look!
  - SexyCyborg 7y ago
    >I mean absolutely no disrespect but as a westerner without any real knowledge of China I only know the stereotype of China being like the wild west where everything gets ripped off. I'm happy to do some research to learn more about it if you could advice me where to look! No offense taken! It seems crazy but things change fast- and yes we still steal loads of stuff and tend not to respect IP not registered in China. I have not found a really good write up in English, I've been meaning to get together with some local friends and do something. But yeah- totally ok to be skeptical, we don't have a stellar track record
- linker3000 7y ago
  I have a couple of really poor Adafruit knockoff I2C PWM expander boards from a couple of years back (Aliexpress seller). The logo/silkscreen is rough, there's a PCB trace missing and the power LED resistor value is too low so the light was blinding until I replaced the resistor. Maybe the situation has changed?

baybal2 7y ago

The whole "maker" seem to have long been appropriated: There is an event going on https://imgur.com/a/5w3P8l4 https://imgur.com/a/5w3P8l4 Shenzhen maker week has no relation to maker fare, but it seem to have surely overtaken it

justinclift 7y ago

> Studying welding and CNC operations now also. Muaa Haaa Haaa. Good stuff. CNC is awesome. :) Seems to turn into a huge (fun) time sink, but expands out the possibilities for creating things. Looking at your video list on YouTube quickly, it seems like good initial learning: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkmVH8knK60 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkmVH8knK60 If/when you're up for a more full-on CNC system - without getting crazy expensive - the Shapeoko 3 is very, very good: * https://community.carbide3d.com/t/hardcore-aluminum-milling-on-an-s3/9744 https://community.carbide3d.com/t/hardcore-aluminum-milling-... <-- stuff done by someone who really knows what they're doing (not me ;>) * https://carbide3d.com/shapeoko/ https://carbide3d.com/shapeoko/ Personally, I started with 3D printing too (FlashForge Creator Pro), and moved into CNC after hitting frustrating limitations with that. Haven't gotten into welding yet (it's on the ToDo list), as no backyard or shed here to do it in. Ugh. :/ In theory, I should be able to find a Maker type place nearby, but haven't investigated that yet. Any idea if there's an equivalent to the Shapeoko in Shenzhen? eg high quality, but low cost So far, all I've seen online is the same cheapo stuff (low quality, low cost) that appears in any kind of Ebay search for CNC. o_O

inflatableDodo 7y ago

>Thanks, the damage was and is pretty bad- and long-lasting. But, "be like water" and all that. I'm slowly pivoting to hardware development. Studying welding and CNC operations now also. Keep at it, you are setting an amazing example here. Very good luck with it all. edit - if you are pivoting to hardware development, get one of these; http://www.latticesemi.com/en/Products/DevelopmentBoardsAndKits/iCE40HX8KBreakoutBoard.aspx http://www.latticesemi.com/en/Products/DevelopmentBoardsAndK... use this on it; http://www.clifford.at/icestorm/ http://www.clifford.at/icestorm/ and this is where you can find some useful modules - https://opencores.org/ https://opencores.org/ Is some of the most fun I have had in ages in making tech do weird shit. I currently have a stepper motor rumnning over optic fibre as the first stage of my new 3d printer build.